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Old 09-27-2010, 08:17 PM   #1
TrueMacedonian
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Default Grigor Prličev (1830 - 1893), Macedonian Literary Activist



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Old 09-27-2010, 10:34 PM   #2
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The language is very colonial ...

'A Slav...'

'Slav language ...'

possibly 'possessed ... a Bulgarian national consciounce' before there was ever a Bulgarian nation, and before Bulgarian national identity had a chance to in fact form itself.

Part of the '...Bulgarian anti-Greek movement of the 1860's and 1870's...'. What a blatant anchronism that is. There were no Bulgarian political units operating anywhere inside Macedonia before 1870.

Nikolova also cites and quotes the biographer and commentator, Kiril Shopakov. If he was a Bulgarian, then he was likely to misrepresent Prlichev as a 'Bulgarian national'. This is given away by his words. He wrote:

Quote:
The autobiography is an important work in which the main customs and traditions of the three main populations of Macedonia ... and their fight for predominance are depicted with simplicity.
Who could he be referring too here? Greeks, Bulgarians and Serbians ?

Author wrote:

Quote:
Prlichev might have deveoped a Macedonian identity ... but there are no clear indications that this in fact happened
. I wonder just what 'measure' this author needs to establish or refute his Macedonian nationality?

There is alot of mischief in this piece and in the blind effort to extricate Prlichev from the nationalisms of governments foriegn to Macedonian territory, there is also an equal effort to extricate him from his ethnic roots - which were Macedonian.

Last edited by Pelister; 09-27-2010 at 10:45 PM.
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Old 09-27-2010, 11:25 PM   #3
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It was an interesting set of opinions that were fundamentally erroneous because the author could not really fathom a Macedonian nationality or ethnicity. When (in the author's opinion) he could not be a Greek or a Bulgarian ... he could not be a Macedonian???

He made an interesting point about the pre-18th century national consciousness which did not exist. Yet wanted to slot Prlicev into either a Bulgarian or Greek one no matter how new these identities must have been.

I think he defined a Macedonian without even knowing it.
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Old 09-28-2010, 12:26 AM   #4
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W in the first part of the article gligor is srtrugling to come to terms as what his identity is.
Whatever he came to say bulgarian,he was not accepted as such not even of greek identity.Just proves at the time people had no national consciousness.Yes in all this he does define that without being aware that he is macedonian.
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Old 09-28-2010, 01:57 AM   #5
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The name he used in Greece was Grigorios Stavridis. This is a small part of his poem:

Παρά τον νέκυν τού Κοσμά βαρυπενθής ο ίππος
εφρύαττεν αιμοσταγής
και κλίνων προς τον ήρωα την χαίτην, βαρυλύπως,
τα νώτα έκρουε της γης.

Με βήμα τρέμον εξορμά η μήτηρ κ’ αμφιβάλλει
αλλ’ εις τον πάνδημον κλαυθμόν
εμάντευσε την συμφοράν, και τ’ όναρ ανεκάλει...
Βαρύν αφήκε βρυχηθμόν

ως πρωτοτόκος λέαινα, ο σκύμνος ης ηρπάγη
υπό θρασέων θηρευτών...
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Old 09-28-2010, 02:01 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thessalo-niki View Post
The name he used in Greece was Grigorios Stavridis.
Do you have any other examples of obvious non-Greeks using Greek names?
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Old 09-28-2010, 08:29 AM   #7
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The article is correct in assessing the pre-national sentiment of the Balkans prior to the mid-19 century. The author, though, misses the Macedonian National Movement. Prlicev was one of its proponents. In one of his speaches he addressed his students: You proud Macedonians, descendents of Alexander and Aristotle... Then he concluded his speach with: A country that gave birth to sons of that magnitude, our dear Macedonia, will give birth to new titans to liberate her.

Bulgarians rejected him because he deliberately refused to use the standard Bulgarian (more or less defined by the mid-1860-ties) and he was trying to create a standard language based on the Macedonian phonology (this article mentiones this). Greeks rejected him because he refused to fully assimilate into a Greek. Even from his poem Serdarot (Armatolos) it is obvious that all of his characters that he has simpathy for are Macedonians (Kuzman, Neda, Rade...), while the vilans are the Albanian Ghegs.

Here is his best poem Serdarot translated in Macedonian:

http://mk.wikibooks.org/wiki/%D0%A1%...87%D0%B5%D0%B2

Thesaloniki, if you have a bigger excerpt of his original greek version, please either upload it in mk.wikibooks.org, or post it here, and I will upload it. (What you already posted, is it the begining of the poem? If you don't know, can you roughly translate it, and I will locate it.)
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Old 09-28-2010, 10:36 AM   #8
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It's this part:
Крај трупот Кузманов со тага коњот 'ржи;
и уште беше тој во крв;
ја копка земјата и лад со гривата му држи
на стопанот и другар прв.
И мајката истрчува со стапка трепет полна
се двоуми, но сал за миг . . .
По плачот општ се сети дека веста беше болна
и танок таа пушти крик,
да, како лавица, што дрско ловците ја гонат
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Old 09-28-2010, 02:31 PM   #9
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Thessaloniki,

I didn't know that you can read and understand Macedonian. Thank you for recognizing the passage.

Now is this transcription that you posted the language that Prlicev used (some form of archaic/classical) or a translation to the modern Greek?

Do you, but any chance, have the begining of the poem, which is by far the most popular in Macedonia. (It employs a figure of speach named slavonic antithesis).
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Old 09-28-2010, 03:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GStojanov View Post
Thessaloniki,

I didn't know that you can read and understand Macedonian. Thank you for recognizing the passage.
I can't. I used Google Translation (as much as it could do anything)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GStojanov View Post
Now is this transcription that you posted the language that Prlicev used (some form of archaic/classical) or a translation to the modern Greek?
It's the original. This language is described as purified/katharevousa. The overall style is of Athens Romatic school, the one that was "in war" with the School of Ionian Islands. It seems they lost this war and are not now remembered (as it is also reflected here)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_...hool_of_poetry
Quote:
Originally Posted by GStojanov View Post
Do you, but any chance, have the begining of the poem, which is by far the most popular in Macedonia. (It employs a figure of speach named slavonic antithesis).
You have to go here:
http://anemi.lib.uoc.gr/metadata/7/c...70-0000032.tkl
Go to Download Document (at the bottom of the page)
Type the two words you see, and a pdf file will open
(There's also an interesting introduction by the author)
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Last edited by thessalo-niki; 09-28-2010 at 03:21 PM.
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