"Prior to 1865, Vlachs everywhere in the Peloponnese"

[Carlin]

- "Prior to 1865, Vlachs everywhere in the Peloponnese.."
- "Number of non-Vlachs remained lower than the Vlachs.."
- "..the Peloponnese consisted mostly, if not entirely, of Vlachs and Albanians.."
- "..the guerrillas were generally Vlachs and Albanians, and in the Greek revolution Vlachs and Albanians, etc etc..."
- "Arcadia ... numerous Vlach villages."
- "Achaia ... Vlach villages."

ΒΛΑΧΟΙ vs γραικών 02.divx - YouTube

[Carlin]

The London Quarterly Review, published in April 1895 and July 1895:
"The Wallachians ... are numerous in the Peloponnesus."

[George S.]

Amazing i knew that they were there but for all that time.It seems to be for a long time.

[Carlin]

As late as 1914 Vlachs lived in a mountain range in the Athens area (Hymettus).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymettus

Source: "Days in Attica", Ellen Sophia Bosanquet (published in 1914).
Please see enclosed screenshots.

Source: "Vlasi, polinomichan narod", Zef Mirdita [Hrvatski institut za povijest]


As per the author, the following territories were regarded as ethnically Vlach regions in the late Middle Ages - and known under the following names:

Page 257:
Thessaly: Great Wallachia
Aetolia, Acarnania, along the coast to the Corinthian gulf: Small Wallachia
Pindus mountains (Epirus): Upper Wallachia
Achaia: Lower Wallachia

Page 257 quote:
"Oni (Vlasi) su zapravo posvuda posvjedoceni kako na Halkidiku, na planinama Rodopa, na azijskom delu Bospora, u Atici, Eubeji, na Peloponezu, tako i na Krfu i drugim Jonskim ostrvima."

If there is still any doubt - a quote from Jakob Philipp Fallmerayer: “Φυλετικό κράμα Σλάβων και Αρβανιτόβλαχων οι σημερινοί Έλληνες”.

[Carlin]

"Zabelezhano e isto taka, deka vo 1854 godina vo Mesinija izbila Vlashka Revolucija. Desetici toponimi na Peloponez se odnesuvaat na Vlasite: Vlasi, Vlahorafti i Vlahofteri vo Gortinija, Vlahopul vo Pilia, Vlahohori vo Lakonija, Vlaheika vo Trizinia, Vlahokerasia vo Mandinia, Vlaheika vo Patra i Vlahiotis vo Epidavr."

- Nikolaos I. Merdzos, "Aromani - Vlasi", Solun, 2012, str. 31.
- Jorgis Eksarhos, "Toa se Vlasite", Atina, 1994, str. 72.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messenia

[Carlin]

Vo 1832. godina, koga nivnoto prisustvo na Peloponez se uste bilo zivo i ne mozelo da se ospori, Konstandinos Kumas napisal: "Rasprostraneti vo razlicni sela, poveketo planinski, od Makedonija do Peloponez, se takanarecenite Vlasi, koi bile Makedonci, Tesalijci i Grci po rod."

Notable Modern Greeks of Vlach ancestry:

- Rigas Fereos
- Georgakis Olimpios (sorabotnik i soborec na princot A. Ipsilantis)
- Joanis Koletis (prv ustaven premier na Grcija)
- Apostolos Arsakis
- Konstandinos Zapas
- Georgios Averof
- Joakim III Velicestveniot
- Aristotelis Valaoritis (vazna uloga odigral vo prisoedinuvanjeto na Jonskite ostrovi kon Grcija)

http://content.yudu.com/Library/A1ydec/20120907203212/resources/4.htm

http://utrinski.com.mk/?ItemID=C1D223771F44C740AABE5750398EEAC5

[momce]

amazing...and the rural language of greece are mostly creole arvanitovlach

[Carlin]

The "Byzantines" were Latin-speakers as late as the 7th century (..and most likely for the next few centuries). "Mysteriously", some Vlachs appear out of nowhere in 976 AD, for the very first time.

The History of Theophylact Simocatta

Theophylact Simocatta was an early seventh-century Byzantine historiographer, arguably ranking as the last historian of Late Antiquity, writing in the time of Heraclius (c 630) about the late Emperor Maurice (582-602). It is likely that he was writing around 630.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/57083905/The-History-of-Theophylact-Simocatta

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophylact_Simocatta

- And so Heraclius' companions, seeing the hero bathed in his noble blood and marvelling at his courage, set him on horseback and carried him to the camp. Next, they drew out and extracted the other missiles implanted in his body, but the one in his side they were unable to withdraw; for those who are instructed in these things, the skills of Chiron and Machaon, whispered among themselves that with the departure of the weapon his soul would also pass away. But that Macedonian, or Leonidas in spirit, a Callimachus or Cynegeirus, but it will suffice to call it Roman-when he heard the doctors' words, asked if the Romans had been victorious. When the bystanders assented and said that the Latins had raised the trophy, he tested their words on oath. When he had learned that the Romans had in reality gained the lighter pan in the balance of war, whereas the Persians had the opposite turn of the scale and were being dragged down to calamity by the weight of defeat, he leapt up with a gasp, saying that the statement was a great consolation and relief for this pain, and that he now awaited death.

[Romans = Latins]

- The Romans drew near to the Getae (for this is the older name for the barbarians), but did not dare to come to grips, since they were afraid of the javelins which the barbarians were sending from the barricade against their horses. Then their captain, whose name was Alexander, commanded the Romans in the ancestral Roman language* to dismount from their horses and grasp the enemy danger at close quarter.

[* - Latin was still the language of army commands.]

[George S.]

these people the vlachs behaved themselves unlike the albanians who wanted the whole of macedonia for themselves.I don't think there was any resentment of the vlachs & macedonians ,has there ever been any?

[momce]

Theres been some history of vlach-Macedonian cooperation actually. Most of the conflict between them comes in greece where vlachs were resettled satrategically on Macedonian lands by the greek govt. Its odd because historically the pure Vlachs and grecophones have had bad relations. I believe during WWII the vlach and Macedonian states were suppose to be united under one King.

[George S.]

precisely momce we've had nothing but peacefull relations.Some of the vlachs have assimilated into macedonia.Some have become exeplary citizens.As a matter of fact you could say they have become more macedonian & have accepted their status.How is that if the albanians do that as we macedonians do not wish to harm settlers to their culture,language.We are a peacefull people who live in harmony with all races.

[momce]

well i consider vlachs to be a balkan people perhaps related to the old balkan tribes so theres no problem with considering them Macedonians..there is a vlach-Macedonian dialect if I am not mistaken

[George S.]

definitely right there momce.They blend in with the macedonians no doubt about that.They are an fine example for other races to follow.

[Nexus]

Vlachs are one of the Balkans peoples that I know the less the history. Here's what i find on an another forum :

We suppressed nothing, everyone is free to identify as Vlach or Serb anytime. What's Vlach anyway? In different times and at different places it had various connotations. Sometimes it meant a Romance language speaker, sometimes it meant a social class of shepherds (like in medieval Serbia) and sometimes it was a derogatory term for Orthodox Christians (as much as term "Latins" was for Roman Catholics and "Turks" for the Muslims).

Perhaps the very term "Vlach" has something to do with the Slavic word Vlas meaning hair, connected with the Slavic pagan god of wild nature, animals, cattle, known as Veles, Volos, Vles, who was worshiped especially by shepherds. There is also an old Slavic word V'lhv, Vlahov, Volhov, meaning sorcerer, enchanter.

Or perhaps we're here on a different trail, not ethnic but social. Serb and Vlach meaning 2 social classes of one ethnicity, Balkano-Slavic as I already explained in the thread about Russians looking exotic or something. Perhaps Serb is a designation for warrior and agricultural caste, while Vlach is a designation for (pagan) priests/shamans and shepherds.

I think also that Romanians and Albanians are connected, Albanians are a mix of vlachs/slavic speaking peoples with orientals and others influences [See the Kaplan Resuli-Burovic interview]. And :

The "Byzantines" were Latin-speakers as late as the 7th century (..and most likely for the next few centuries). "Mysteriously", some Vlachs appear out of nowhere in 976 AD, for the very first time.

Mysteriously at the same time (X century), some Albanians appear too ...

What's your thoughts?

[momce]

Not sure but these "bridges" are critical for understanding the ethnography of the entire region. Curiously there dont seem to be any greek idioms in Macedonia only standard greek(political construct).