Origins of the Greek language

[DedoAleko]

како што сум запознаен „коине" не е еднакво на грчки јазик

[Vangelovski]

како што сум запознаен „коине" не е еднакво на грчки јазик

Може сум погрешен, но како што сум запознаен јас, Коин е грчки јазик и е веќе докажано дека е грчки јазик. Може има локални варијанти со додадовци од локалните јазици, но да се лажеме дека е Македонски јазик или нешто слично е само заблуда.

Но, што има врска тоа со текстот во Судан. Како можеш да си толку сигурен дека не е грчки или коин кога самиот не знаеш што јазик е?

[DedoAleko]

нели е факт дека „коине" не е баш ексклузивно „грчки" туку бил користен во многу поширока форма како на пр. источното римско царство,фанариотите,во отоманска империја,...?

[Vangelovski]

нели е факт дека „коине" не е баш ексклузивно „грчки" туку бил користен во многу поширока форма како на пр. источното римско царство,фанариотите,во отоманска империја,...?

Нема врска јазикот кај и кога е користен. Битно е ликсиконот и граматиката. И Англискиот јазик е користен низ цел свет, но пак е Англиски. Не можеме сега да докажеме дека Англискиот е Индиски или Јужно Африкански заради што е користен во тие држави како официјален. Крај на краишта пак е Англиски лексикон со Англиска граматика. Коине е грчки јазик заради што лексиконот е грчки (значи грчки зборови) и граматиката е грчка.

Јасно е дека имаше додатоци во разни места од локалните јазици, и со време и самиот Коине се смена како и сите јазици, нот тоа не значи дека јазикот (лексиконот и граматиката) не е грчки.

[George S.]

the alphabet isn't the greek taken from the phonecians.???

[Redsun]

I can't upload Alphabet chart, its on the net just google "Phoenician greek"

[George S.]

does anyone know why the ancient Macedonian alphabet had 36 letters and all the others like greek had only 25 letters.Me thinks ancient Macedonian was a far richer alphabet.Correct me if im wrong.Also I think a lot of other indo European alphabets,phonetic may have been derived from ancient Macedonian.What evidence is there?

[Risto the Great]

The Phoenician derived Hellenic alphabets were adequate for the Hellenes. But clearly not for the Macedonians. We have more sounds. We even used to have "th" in our alphabet.

[Vangelovski]

There arn't necessarily more sounds in the Macedonian language then others, its that other languages use two or more letters to construct a sound where as Macedonian has a letter for each sound. For example, in English you would have 'ch' whereas in Macedonian you would simply have 'ч'.

[Gocka]

There arn't necessarily more sounds in the Macedonian language then others, its that other languages use two or more letters to construct a sound where as Macedonian has a letter for each sound. For example, in English you would have 'ch' whereas in Macedonian you would simply have 'ч'.

Yes exactly, in fact I think many other languages have much more sounds then Macedonian. In English for example you can combine many different vowels to make different sounds and also depending on the placement of consonants you can get even more sounds, so even though the alphabet has 26 letters I think you can easily make 40 sounds maybe more. Then for example in Russian and German you have accents that change the sound a letter makes also increasing the amount of sounds you can make.

I actually love the simplicity of the Macedonian language, its grammar and alphabet are so easy to use making it very hard to be illiterate. Phonetic spelling makes it impossible to spell anything wrong, and the vocabulary is not that broad so its rare you come across a word that you dont know or have never heard (except for new bastardized English words with Macedonian sounding annunciations), unlike in English where you can go an entire lifetime and still not know hundreds of words and their meanings.

[Risto the Great]

There arn't necessarily more sounds in the Macedonian language then others, its that other languages use two or more letters to construct a sound where as Macedonian has a letter for each sound. For example, in English you would have 'ch' whereas in Macedonian you would simply have 'ч'.

There are more sounds in the Macedonian language as compared to Greek.
"sh" and "zh" are a couple of examples.
They don't construct it.

[Vangelovski]

Phonetic spelling makes it impossible to spell anything wrong.

Actually, its very easy to misspell words in Macedonian, particularly if you are relying on a local dialect to pronounce something. People also generally make a mess of л and љ, г and ѓ, and н and њ.

Also, its spelling is not completely phonetic, for example 'саат' (watch or time). Its spelt with a double 'a', whereas its pronounced with only one 'a'. There are other examples, not many, but the point is that its not completely phonetic.

[George S.]

words change over time as well as their meanings.There was a Macedonian proessor who didscovered that there are thousands of English words that are derived from Macedonian root words.Maybe someone knows the professors name.

[Gocka]

Good point but it is phonetic 99% of the time, and other then a few exceptions its very easy to learn and use. Its obvious that Macedonian was meant for everyone to learn and use, where as English is obviously for pompous aristocrats. It has so many unnecessary rules, exceptions and combinations. For example you used "spelt" which I believe is "spelled", you would think an educated guy who I still think is a professor would not make a simple mistake, but that's just the kind of language English is. It is made up so pompous assholes can correct people all the time and feel superior, its not a language for everyone to know and be fully literate in.

Simple isn't always bad, in computers and mechanical engineering the guy who can come up with the simplest way to write a command or to get a job done is the smartest guy.

Actually, its very easy to misspell words in Macedonian, particularly if you are relying on a local dialect to pronounce something. People also generally make a mess of л and љ, г and ѓ, and н and њ.

Also, its spelling is not completely phonetic, for example 'саат' (watch or time). Its spelt with a double 'a', whereas its pronounced with only one 'a'. There are other examples, not many, but the point is that its not completely phonetic.

[Vangelovski]

Gocka,

English, like most other languages, including Macedonian, wasn't 'designed'. It evolved over centuries. English is so 'disordered' (for want of a better word) because as far as I'm aware its never been codified or standardised. Macedonian was standardised in the 1940's (that does not mean it was invented - rather a standardised lexicon and grammar were chosen as the official 'standard Macedonian' rather than relying on regional dialects, which is a fairly common process among most languages).

That's why English seems chaotic, whereas standard Macedonian is very structured, though in my view this limits Macedonian to a certain degree and it lacks the flexibility that English has in wording things in so many different ways and according to personal preference/ability. Standard Macedonian (as opposed to its regional dialects), I find, requires a lot of memorisation and conformity with fairly strict rules, whereas English is extremely flexible and creative.

The snobbishness around English is not different to Macedonian in that most people just use words without knowing or accepting their common usage meaning and then try to ascribe their own meaning to them, rendering the use of language meaningless as a form of communication.