Australian Born Macedonians.

[axil]

Welcome to the forum, and thanks for the insight into your situation.

How did your grandmother come to have a Greek surname prior to Greece's occupation of Macedonia in 1913? The only possibility is records from patriarchist institutions (churches, schools, etc) but that doesn't explain why she wouldn't use her Macedonian surname when she arrived in Australia. Do you know the reason for that? And why would you try to think of a new Macedonian surname? If it's something like Bogdanis, Petrou, etc, it can easily be rendered in Macedonian. If it's a purely Greek name then your previous one was completely different. Most Macedonian families are aware of their older names, isn't yours?

I don't consider that a reasonable excuse, to be honest. If I carried a name that was imposed by foreigners, but was now in a position and adequate state of mind to make amends, I would rectify that matter immediately by changing it back to its original Macedonian form.

To be honest I am going to have to ask my parents to clarify that one for you! I will let you know with a proper answer however. My Dad in particular is pretty keen to have the surname changed.

[axil]

Do not change your last name.

It is evidence to what the Greek state has done to the ethnic Macedonians living within its "democratic country".

What selo did your grandparents come from?

What is selo? Like area?

My Dedo came from Kotori and my Buba from Ochid (excuse the spelling).

[The LION will ROAR]

Axil, Selo means Village and Kafani means Cafe's
I think you mean your baba's from Ohrid....?

[The LION will ROAR]

From what I understand there a Macedonians that are still keeping the Greek surname in the hope one day they will be able claim their land/property back from the Greek Government. .they are afraid to change their surname as to lose any chance of getting back what's rightfully theirs..

[axil]

I question the viability of the Macedonian consciousness existing amongst the Australian diaspora beyond another generation. It's not just the dinner dances, but other Macedonian functions/gatherings that also starkly evidence this. Who here has been to Geelong, King Lake or Connor reserve recently and hasn't felt sadness at witnessing the terminal decline of these institutions???

We have a hall up here in the west of sydney. I have been told apparently it use to be used all the time, now it is seldom once or twice a year.

[axil]

Axil, Selo means Village and Kafani means Cafe's
I think you mean your baba's from Ohrid....?

Thanks, yes I mean Ohrid.

[axil]

Welcome Axil.
I am confident this thread will have "legs" and continue for some time.
There are a few issues you have raised and I look forward to everyone's input.

The first thing worth mentioning is that nobody is more or less Macedonian than you (if you feel Macedonian). You can easily awaken your connection to your identity and we can discuss this as you participate longer on this forum.

I changed my name just before I received my degree. I refused to have a professional life with my "slave name". I was very well known with my "slave name" so thought there would be far more consequences than what actually eventuated. It was no big deal and I think it is extremely symbolic to change your name back to your traditional family name.

Having an "ich" or "os" etc. on the end of your name makes you no less Macedonian, yet it does little to affirm your identity publicly in my opinion. I strongly encourage all Macedonians with "slave names" to seek their traditional names and restore their identity.

Thanks Risto.

It makes me feel a bit better reading I am not alone with these thoughts.

[The LION will ROAR]

We have a hall up here in the west of sydney. I have been told apparently it use to be used all the time, now it is seldom once or twice a year.

Axil, you wouldn't be from Richmond..? as there are allot of Egeci living there...a friend from Richmond who also is from the Agean part of Macedonia says that many there half of the time think their Greek and half the time Macedonian..just when it suits them..

[axil]

Axil, you wouldn't be from Richmond..? as there are allot of Egeci living there...a friend from Richmond who also is from the Agean part of Macedonia says that many there half of the time think their Greek and half the time Macedonian..just when it suits them..

I am from Richmond! Well, I live about 5 minutes away. You are going to have to excuse my ignorance as I am still learning, what is Egeci?

Agean is the southern part of Macedonia isn't it?

[The LION will ROAR]

I am from Richmond! Well, I live about 5 minutes away. You are going to have to excuse my ignorance as I am still learning, what is Egeci?

Agean is the southern part of Macedonia isn't it?

Egeci is Agean and yes southern part...

Is this true about what my friend stated about some of our fellow Macedonians in richmond feeling greek or Macedonian when it suits them..?

[axil]

Egeci is Agean and yes southern part...

Is this true about what my friend stated about some of our fellow Macedonians in richmond feeling greek or Macedonian when it suits them..?

I'll get back to you on that one.

[Onur]

From what I understand there a Macedonians that are still keeping the Greek surname in the hope one day they will be able claim their land/property back from the Greek Government. .they are afraid to change their surname as to lose any chance of getting back what's rightfully theirs..

Whats that got to do with having Greek name or not?

Greece is an EU member and all members and candidates accepts EU court of human rights as a supreme court above all their internal state courts.

All you need is your land registry papers. Sue them in EU courts of human rights and get your lands back or make them pay compensation for your confiscated lands. Greek Cypriots does same for northern Cyprus for years, why don't you?

You don't need to be a Greek or someone with Greek surname to be able to sue them in EU courts. Don't you have Macedonian associations in Australia? Gather as many people you can find with same problem, then hire a lawyer in Belgium and sue them.

[Voltron]

Whats that got to do with having Greek name or not?

Greece is an EU member and all members and candidates accepts EU court of human rights as a supreme court above all their internal state courts.

All you need is your land registry papers. Sue them in EU courts of human rights and get your lands back or make them pay compensation for your confiscated lands. Greek Cypriots does same for northern Cyprus for years, why don't you?

You don't need to be a Greek or someone with Greek surname to be able to sue them in EU courts. Don't you have Macedonian associations in Australia? Gather as many people you can find with same problem, then hire a lawyer in Belgium and sue them.

Your a piece of work, you know that ? There are UN resolutions in place for Cyprus. And as far as restoration for properties you can practice what you preach by restoring all the properties confiscated during the the progrom against Greeks, and not only.

For what its worth Axil, there are many Greeks that have the the -oglou suffix to their name. It doesnt matter. Its consciousness that is paramount to all. The rest is trivial.

[julie]

Hi Axil, welcome to the MTO

I am first generation Aussie Macedonian in Australia to a mother from village Dolno Kotori, Lerin region , Aegean Macedonia, and a father from village Oleveni Bitola region, Macedonia

My maternal grandparents changed their Greek imposed name after the civil war in 1948.
Changing your name in Australia is not difficult, just a bit tedious in that everything is changed in regard to identity, its no big deal.

I suffer the same fate as Bill, I have 3 sons, one of which understands Macedonian and has limited speaking abilitites with the language and the younger 2 that dont understand the language. Their father was not of Macedonian background and it made it difficult to continue attending Macedonian functions , church etc as he did not want to expose the children to the culture to what he called overkill excess. At first he was very keen, and when my eldest would speak Macedonian to me and my family, and English to him and his family, his family would get upset and state they did not want my 3 year old to speak foreign (strange as they were Sri Lankan) It caused me anguish and grief, and eventually we split, but it seemed too hard to speak in Macedonian to my younger 2 sons and easier for me to converse in English to them. My Macedonian is pretty average, I read and write in the cyrillic alphabet, and talk to my dad in Macedonian all the time, to keep my language skills up, or when I attend church

I encourage all Macedonians from the diaspora to meet someone of Macedonian background. In Adelaide it is a very small community and my generation, as much as I wanted to marry Macedonian and continue with my beloved culture, my age group males were limited in number, and most had no interest in the Macedonian women, and I was not keen on marrying someone much older than me. Some married Macedonians and I look at my younger brothers age group, where most married Macedonians, and applaud them
It is easier raised in the diaspora for people to marry like minded and similar people, and my boys find it difficult to "fit in" and say they feel out of place. My eldest tends to come along to church every now and then , the middle son does not have any interest much to my consternation, and my youngest son idolises his older brother , so comes along the rare times I am able to attend (health reasons, and when I do attend, the typical questioning of whats wrong with me and the wailing by the older women gets embarrassing for my boys , lol , the youngest hates having his cheeks squeezed by the old babas, )
However, they identify as Macedonian when asked of their cultural background
If Macedonians in your area hold functions, it would be awesome for you to attend, or you can find out where they "hang out" to meet the girls.
Growing up, I fully expected I would eventually meet and marry a Macedonian, it was an expectation and I was keen as it would have made it easier with the religion, culture and traditions. Now with my sons , I would LOVE a Macedonian daughter-in-law, so I may continue to speak in Macedonian to my grandchildren, and continue with my Macedonian cultures and traditions to pass down to my grandchildren.
You are lucky living interstate, Adelaide Macedonian community is terribly small and the likelihood of the boys meeting someone they are not related to as well makes it most unlikely too.
Good luck in your endeavours too, I sincerely hope you meet a lovely Macedonian girl. Incidently, I would say we are the most beautiful women in the world too and the most domesticated in regard to cooking

If you wish to change your name, do it, and you showing an interest is great, you will find you will learn a lot from the people on the forum, some of the threads are awesome, have some great postings in the history section etc.

I am sure your mum would love a Macedonian daughter - in - law, sometimes destiny and fate step in though and things just dont happen for whatever reason, good luck in your pursuits. When you get to middle age, its amazing how much more you feel the pull for your own people and culture, I mimic and parraot my own parents now and understand why, its in the blood, and I say to my 3 sons, one day you will find the need to know more.

[Risto the Great]

Axil, with your Dedo coming from Kotori, I would suggest we might even be related. A few of us on this forum have connections to Kotori.
Send me a private message with your family name as you know it.
My family name came from an ancestor called "Milanko". It was changed to Miliankos (also seen Miliangou on a document) by the Greeks. Not as bad as some names had been changed but nevertheless a baptism of new ethnicity was the obvious agenda.

When I thought about restoring my family name, I discussed it with my father and my grandfather. My grandfather was fearful that our relatives would be persecuted in Greece because of this. My father was very much for it. I questioned the name and considered the endings I was aware of:

Milankovski (ski ending was not even close to appropriate, no oral history of that ending in our family)
Milankov (a very real option, common ending that prima facie was the most logical choice)
Milankovtsi (not really an option but the most used name to refer to the family as a collective by Macedonians)
Milanko (easiest option that recalled the original ancestor's first name in its entirety, supported by a number of Macedonian surnames in use over 200 years ago, possibly the most authentic surname version for our region of Macedonia).

Personally, I am not even sure the "v" ending is automatically Macedonian. I suspect it became more prevalent during Exarchate times as family names were documented more systematically.

That was my thought process on the matter and I am proud of my family name. I always felt a burden with my "slave name" and support anyone looking to be more honest with their identity.