Discussion on languages and etymologies

[Voltron]

See the below excerpt from Brailsford:

No speculation, it's the truth.

I saw the excerpt but I think he is over exaggerating. I hear oikia being used and its not that extremely rare. If it was learnt in school or not is also not a big deal. Why the heck did I have to take English 101 at school then ? Ok, some teachers wanted to cleanse the language and try to restore some orginal Greek words. Even if thats the case, I dont see why that is such a bad thing ? Oikia is also used as a prefix for many words like Oikopedo " land lot " is there a Spitopedo ? No there isnt so its not like the word is completely lost and resurrected from the dead.

Can you cite the quote and chapter number for that, Po-drum? Would be interested to see it. The ancient Greeks did use such a word for water, but modern Greeks use 'nero', so do the Cypriots. Apparently Etruscans use 'neri' and Sanskrit uses 'nira', but have to confirm that. I have also noticed that the capital of Kenya which is known as Nairobi is also related to water. Not sure if it is connected in any way. Greeks claim that their word comes from 'nearon' which is supposed to mean 'fresh'. Who knows. But worthy of taking a deeper look.

Yes, we do use Nero for water. Interesting thread btw.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Speculation at this point.

See the below excerpt from Brailsford:

I once had to send a telegram in which I made use of the words kainourio spiti (new house). No sane Greek in speaking would ever use any other combination of words to indicate the same idea. But the clerk remonstrated. I must mean nea oikia. And when I protested that I wished to telegraph, not in ancient but in modern Greek, he retorted that when he was at school he would have been thrashed at a first offence for writing spiti and expelled for the second. And yet, despite its foreign origin, neither he nor any other living man in Greece ever dreamed of using in daily speech any word save spiti (hospitium). It is the name that the child uses for his home before he has been taught that the ancients had another. No peasant, and few women, would even know what oikia means. The one word has all the associations of the mother tongue; the other, for all that it is Hellenic, is foreign and unfamiliar, as colourless as an algebraic symbol. For literature the prohibition of the first word is disastrous. It means that it has at its disposal no word which stirs an emotional echo. It is as though we were to erase "home" from all our poetry and substitute "residence."

No speculation, it's the truth.

Voltron in what extent is widespread the term "idor" about water at Greeks??
It's sounding very close to macedonian "voda", and while I'm reading "Cratilo" by Platon I can see that he claims this word is not of hellenic origin, but rather barbaric.

Can you cite the quote and chapter number for that, Po-drum? Would be interested to see it. The ancient Greeks did use such a word for water, but modern Greeks use 'nero', so do the Cypriots. Apparently Etruscans use 'neri' and Sanskrit uses 'nira', but have to confirm that. I have also noticed that the capital of Kenya which is known as Nairobi is also related to water. Not sure if it is connected in any way. Greeks claim that their word comes from 'nearon' which is supposed to mean 'fresh'. Who knows. But worthy of taking a deeper look.

[Voltron]

Voltron in what extent is widespread the term "idor" about water at Greeks??
It's sounding very close to macedonian "voda", and while I'm reading "Cratilo" by Platon I can see that he claims this word is not of hellenic origin, but rather barbaric.

I dont hear it used as Idor anymore Po-drum. "Hydro" ok that is more common. Ιδρώτας for example. That term must be very old and may have changed, the r and o being switched. Im not a linguist by any means and never had the opportunity to take Ancient Greek classes like most here do. Voda kind of sounds like water to me.

[Po-drum]

Speculation at this point. Kathervousa always gets a bad rep. but I happen to think it was a good initiative. And although it had good intentions it was never accepted.

Voltron in what extent is widespread the term "idor" about water at Greeks??
It's sounding very close to macedonian "voda", and while I'm reading "Cratilo" by Platon I can see that he claims this word is not of hellenic origin, but rather barbaric.

[Voltron]

Were it not for the katharevousa project it wouldn't be used at all.

Speculation at this point. Kathervousa always gets a bad rep. but I happen to think it was a good initiative. And although it had good intentions it was never accepted.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Were it not for the katharevousa project it wouldn't be used at all.

[Voltron]

Diasporites dont use it as much. Over here in Greece I have heard it being used. Just saying.

[Bill77]

Yes, Spiti is the most common term for house. But once in while you'll still hear people use the original term Oikia.

I deal with Greeks alot.

Never heard of the word.

[Voltron]

That is the ancient Greek word. I have never heard a Greek use any other word aside from 'spiti' for a house.

Yes, Spiti is the most common term for house. But once in while you'll still hear people use the original term Oikia.

[Soldier of Macedon]

The meaning of "oba" slightly changed in Turkish because there are no nomads or "oba"s in our lives anymore but it`s main sense is "encampment spot" [of nomad groups]. If you checked google translate, it doesn't give full meaning of it but this web site has better Turkish-English dictionary;

http://tureng.com/search/oba

Why would i lie to you anyway, why you are so skeptical???

Btw, the word "abi" means "senior, elder, wise men who has experience, elder relative" in general Turkic.

Onur, first of all, can you stop writing like a 6 year old with multiple question marks????????? Seriously, it is quite annoying. Second, you're trying to connect words that don't appear to have any relation to each other, which is the reason why I am skeptical. I never suggested that you lied, I just don't agree with your understanding on how the words are related. Even in the link you provided the main word for 'oba' is a tent, and that is how it would appear to be related to an encampment. I could be wrong, but then again you could do a much better job in being convincing. As for 'abi', this is yet another one of your attempts at folk etymology and has nothing to do with the Baltic word.

e/ le f te ria
s/ lo b oda (rija - arch. form)

They are probably cognate based on the sound changes b/f and d/th. The 's' at the beginning of the Macedonian word may indicate that the Greek word 'eleftheria' initially began with a 'k' or a 'h' but dropped it at some point.

The greek word for house is actually "oikia" from the noun "oikos" which means house, household or family.

That is the ancient Greek word. I have never heard a Greek use any other word aside from 'spiti' for a house.

[Voltron]

The greek word for house is actually "oikia" from the noun "oikos" which means house, household or family.

Eleftheria is Greek and comes from " Eleftheros ' which means free.

[Po-drum]

The Greek word 'spiti' comes from Latin 'hospitium'. The Slavic word 'obitel' comes from 'oba' (both), from which other words can be formed such as 'obiti' (wrap, bind), 'obitel' (lodging, monastery) - essentially a place where people come together.

So there is no substantial connection between this words.

I was searching about simillarities between slavic "sloboda" and corresponding words in another indo-european languages. This is something which could be connected:

e/ le f te ria
s/ lo b oda (rija - arch. form)

But I have found "eleutheria" is also used in Latin. Is this word greek or borrrowing by latin?

[Onur]

The meaning of "oba" slightly changed in Turkish because there are no nomads or "oba"s in our lives anymore but it`s main sense is "encampment spot" [of nomad groups]. If you checked google translate, it doesn't give full meaning of it but this web site has better Turkish-English dictionary;

http://tureng.com/search/oba

Why would i lie to you anyway, why you are so skeptical???

Btw, the word "abi" means "senior, elder, wise men who has experience, elder relative" in general Turkic.

[Soldier of Macedon]

The word "oba" exists in all slavic languages or just in Macedonian???

It would exist in all of them in one form or another. It was most likely first recorded in Old Macedonian, and is cognate with Baltic 'abi' which has the same meaning. It could also be related to the English word 'both'. The Turkish word 'oba' seems to mean something like a 'tent' and 'ova' means a field like you suggested on the other thread, so I am not sure if they are even related to each other let alone to the Slavic words.

[slovenec zrinski]

In slovenian we say for example "oba dva" = both of us, so it apparently exists in Slovenian as well...