Slavic Migration

[Soldier of Macedon]

Misirkov declares as a Macedonian, and he explains why Macedonians called themselves 'Bulgarians' during certain periods in history. The name 'Bulgar' was dropped rapidly because it did not reflect reality or the historical truth. All other reference by him as a 'Bulgarian' is either falsified Bulgarian propaganda by the likes of donkeys such as Karakachanov and co. or during questionable times in his life.

Read his works properly, fully and comprehensively, Misirkov knew exactly what the difference between a Macedonian and a Bulgar were, as did the people that Slavejkov demonized as 'Macedonists' - Fancy that, even as early as the 1850's Macedonians were claiming Alexander the Great as their historical ancestor and calling the Bulgarians a mere horde of Tatars.

And here you are, Slavcho a.k.a Selim, the confused peasant who probably fames himself on spreading lies on a Macedonian forum, pretending to be Macedonian, ебати будалио ебати..........

[Daskalot]

To bad, I would have liked to debate with a 'nash turchin' instead we get a Booger

[Sarafot]

As I said before, I'm not a Muslim, I'm an Orthodox Christian.
Not just several, but ALL Christians have pagan, or pre - Christian customs and rituals. My point was that Macedonian Christians have Slavic customs. I wonder, wy they are not "antic Macedonian" ones.
I know where were Pejčinović and Misirkov from, I gave them as an example. if you don't get my point, I'll give you another: Let's compare Tetovo dialect at Pejčinović's time and today's Tetovo dialect. There are huge differences. Today's Macedonian standard language is based on Bulgarian language (Ohrid dialect was under direct influence of Bulgarian language), and the letters are based on Serbian letters. Mislirkov declared himself as a Bulgarian. His idea was to protect the Slavs in Macedonia from non - Slavic Greeks, not from Bulgarians and Serbs. Macedonian is based on central dialects? Are Ohrid and Struga in central Macedonia? Misirkov, as a Bulgarian, wanted to form a Macedonian state (država), not Macedonian nation (narod).
And now, let me answer my own question (you were right, I have already formed an opinion and answer to it): The purpose of using the cyrillic letters by our nation is that they were dedicated for us, but not as Macedonians, but as Slavs. Yes, they are letters used before too, but they were adjusted for Slavic use.
I think that Slavic identity of today's Macedonians is not a question (we are obviously Slavs). The right question is: Were the ancient Macedonians Slavs too, so that we could name ourselves their descendants.

A ebati pedero! Misirkov e bil MAKEDONEC a ti si beter od Bugar,kuče!!

[caparovski]

Hello, zdravo
My family muslim macedons-torbeshi
I'm from Turkey.
јас сум македонец,ние сме Македонци
We are macedonians.

[Risto the Great]

Welcome Caparovski,
I hope you really are from Turkey.
Your opinions would be of great interest to us here.
Dobrodoide.

[Daskalot]

Hello, zdravo
My family muslim macedons-torbeshi
I'm from Turkey.
јас сум македонец,ние сме Македонци
We are not slavs, greks or bulgarians. We are macedonians.

Ubavo, how are you in Turkey? Are there many Macedonians in Turkey?

[osiris]

dobro doide caparovski kazhi neshto za istoriata no tvoeta familia , od koe mesto vo makednia ste i koga oidote vo turtsia.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Hello, zdravo
My family muslim macedons-torbeshi
I'm from Turkey.
јас сум македонец,ние сме Македонци
We are not slavs, greks or bulgarians. We are macedonians.

Welcome Caparo, forgive some of the scepticism of our members (including myself), as you can see, we have had quite a few pretenders posing as 'Macedonians', 'Torbeshi', etc. Perhaps you can eliminate this doubt from the start by telling us a little about your family history.

If you are a Torbesh as you say you are, then you are in the company of fellow Macedonians here.

[Sarafot]

Hello, zdravo
My family muslim macedons-torbeshi
I'm from Turkey.
јас сум македонец,ние сме Македонци
We are not slavs, greks or bulgarians. We are macedonians.

Dobrodojde,bujrum,Makedonlarm,please tell us more?

[caparovski]

Risto The Great,osiris,Soldier of macedon,Sarafot thanks.
I speak a little bit Macedonian,
I speak a little bit English, soryy...
Accepting the Islam with the Mijak Macedonians in Reka is a process that started in XVI and lasted until the second half of XIX century. However, this conversion from one into another confession was not massive but rather individual and lasted for a long period of time.
First records of Muslims in the Reka region date from 1852, and are recorded in Turkish defters. They say that in the regions of Dolna (Lower), Mala (Small) and Golema (Big) Reka there are 23 villages with Christian and Muslim households; 559 Christian households and 239 bachelor Christians, as well as 120 Muslim households and 14 bachelor Muslims. In addition, in the region of Gorna (Upper) Reka there were 13 villages with 383 Christian households and 132 Islamized Christians, as well as 42 Muslim households, in the same period.
Next document that speaks about the Islamization of the Macedonians is a letter from the Sultan Yahya to the Roman Pope in 1644, where there is a record of coverting into Islam by numerous Christian families. The letter states the conversion of 800 Catholics from upper and lower Debar and of another 800 people from Reka into Islam.
History science says that there was no single reason for accepting the Islam, but rather many motives. The main motive is the need for protection of the population (especially the one in the Reka region) from the Albanian gangs which were intruding from Albania and raiding the region on daily basis. In fact, the only way out from this state of raids and plunders done by Albanian kachaks – mainly from Ljuma and Mat – who also killed people, was accepting the Islam, as in that case the Ottoman Empire would provide more efficient protection of the inhabitants.
In addition, a strategic target of the Turks in late medieval period was creation of Muslim zone between rebellion Albanians and tactical ravines (Reka and Kičevo-Jama).

There is an interesting fact stated by Galaba Palikruševa, PhD, in her works about the Islamization of the Macedonians, where it is declared that many people from Reka in the early stages of Islamization have just virtually changed their first and family names. This proves that bi-confessionalism in the Reka villages lasted from the beginning of the Islamization until the XVIII century. In accordance with the economical interest, the Islamization spread slowly and peacefully. With Islam acceptance among the Mijaks, new relations in the group were created, based on religious differences and two names for the same ethnicity appeared – Mijaci and Torbeshi. During time, these groups acquired different behaviors, but their relationship always remained friendly.
Toma Smiljanić, PhD, one of the first explorers of Gorna Reka, states that sometimes only a part of the family would accept Islam, but the family would remain compact. He presents the fact that in 1920's the Popovci family from Nistrovo still had Macedonian Muslim relatives. The same is the case with the family Venovci from the village of Vrben (Macedonian Christians) with Macedonian Muslim relatives in the village of Žužnje.

* In the preparation of this text, materials were used from Gligor Todorovski's book Demographical Changes in Macedonia from the Late XIV Century until the Balkan Wars and PhD dissertation of Galaba Palikruševa PhD: Islamization of Torbeshi and Establishing of Torbesh Sub-group.

ние сме Македонци.

Zboruvate li Turski ?
Bazı kaynaklar makedon kökenli olduğumuzu anlatıyor, merak edip incelemek istedim ama kökenden çok kültürümüzle ilgileniyorum ve kültürümüzü inceliyorum.
Kültürümüzle ilgili bir çok şeyi unutmaya başladık.
Din ve aradan geçen zaman içinde Türkiyede torbeşler herkesle barış içinde uyumlu bir şekilde yaşıyor, yaşıyoruz.Türk milletinin bir ferdiyiz ve bağlarımız çok büyük.
Makedonyayı çok seviyoruz.Çok büyük gönül bağlarımız var.
Thanks,blagodaram,teşekkürler.

[Risto the Great]

Well said Caparovski.
I have wondered about the Islamisation of Macedonians. Defense against the raiding Albanians makes sense.

pozdrav

[Soldier of Macedon]

Good information and statements Caparo, thank you.

[Mr. MASO]

Very nice Caparovski. Very interesting..

[Sarafot]

Good thing on way of uniteing our people,i was once watching Pasko Kuzman visiting Capadocia,some how they mentioned that there is around 3 milion of Macedonians with islamic faith??

Opinions??

[MapleLeaf1]

Yas ne sum Turks,, I'm orijin Macedon.

Dobro doijde Caparovski, thank you for that informative and insightful post
BRAVO