United Macedonia Diaspora

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  • Mikail
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 1338

    Many Macedonians (and non-Macedonians for that matter), don't appear to understand that Macedonian's have done nothing but compromise in order to achieve that ultimate goal of sovereignty.

    There is no room left for any more concessions for us to make.

    Further compromise is no longer an option.

    It is a shame UMD has chosen not to comment here.
    From the village of P’pezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

    Comment

    • Vangelovski
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2008
      • 8533

      Originally posted by amitreski View Post
      No it is not.
      Another disengenious attempt. Are you now claiming that a defence of the Interim Accord does not show support? What does it show Aleks? Subservience maybe? UMD has gone beyond defending it, it has called on Greece to abide by it. If if calls on Greece to abide by it, then UMD must expect Macedonia to do the same.
      If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

      The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

      Comment

      • Vangelovski
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2008
        • 8533

        Originally posted by amitreski View Post
        What anti-Macedonian institutions? NATO and EU? The same institutions that are supported by the Macedonians in The Republic of Macedonia by 90%?
        Mitreski - are you claiming that NATO and the EU do not have any anti-Macedonia policies? How do you explain their insistence that Macedonia implement the Framework Agreement and (to use UMD's own word) "abide" by the Interim Accord? Or do you believe that these treasonous agreements are not anti-Macedonian?
        If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

        The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

        Comment

        • Vangelovski
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 8533

          Originally posted by amitreski View Post
          Meto right now does not support ANY NAME CHANGE.
          Yes, maybe RIGHT NOW. RIGHT NOW being the key words. But we know how he is capable of flip-flopping, like other UMD board members, depending on the "circumstances" and the "proposals at the time".
          If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

          The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

          Comment

          • Vangelovski
            Senior Member
            • Sep 2008
            • 8533

            Mitreski, seeing as your posting again, maybe you could provide an answer to this?
            If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

            The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

            Comment

            • Vangelovski
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 8533

              Back to the top - Mitreski/Meto?
              If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

              The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

              Comment

              • Homer MakeDonski
                Member
                • Jan 2010
                • 103

                Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
                Another disengenious attempt. Are you now claiming that a defence of the Interim Accord does not show support? What does it show Aleks? Subservience maybe? UMD has gone beyond defending it, it has called on Greece to abide by it. If if calls on Greece to abide by it, then UMD must expect Macedonia to do the same.
                UMD behind Interim Accord ?
                UMD supporting F.Y.R.O.M. ?




                Does it means UMD also has quited supporting Macedonian national minority at occupied territory's (if it was any support ? )
                Last edited by Homer MakeDonski; 02-12-2010, 06:19 PM.

                Comment

                • Vangelovski
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 8533

                  Just to remind the readers what the Interim Accord is and what UMD supports:

                  **********

                  The full text of the Interim Accord (from the UN database) can be found here:

                  http://untreaty.un.org/unts/120001_1...3/00004456.pdf


                  Key Articles in the Interim Accord which Undermine Macedonian Sovereignty

                  a) Macedonia agrees to negotiate over its name (Article 5);

                  b) Macedonia agrees to renounce all claims to its ethnic/historic territory and agrees NOT to pursue the rights of Macedonians not only in Greece but in ANY OTHER STATE (Article 6);

                  c) Macedonia agrees to renounce the Sonce as its national symbol AND any other symbols that Greece considers to be part of its historic or cultural heritage (Article 7);

                  d) Macedonia agrees to only enter international organisations under FYROM (Article 11); and

                  e) Macedonia agrees that the two parties will not “resolve” the name dispute through the International Court of Justice – i.e., Igor Janev’s proposal (Article 21).

                  **********

                  UMD can make all sorts of statements, but that the end of the day, the substance lies here and UMD has repeadetly called for the implementatin of this Accord.



                  Last edited by Vangelovski; 02-12-2010, 06:27 PM.
                  If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

                  The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

                  Comment

                  • Serdarot
                    Member
                    • Feb 2010
                    • 605

                    YouTube - Boxer dog barking at geese



                    me barking at some geese (guski)
                    Last edited by Serdarot; 02-12-2010, 06:57 PM.
                    Bratot:
                    Никој не е вечен, а каузава не е нова само е адаптирана на новите услови и ќе се пренесува и понатаму.

                    Comment

                    • UMDiaspora.org
                      Member
                      • Oct 2009
                      • 525

                      Come out Sunday, February 14 at 8:00 p.m. for the Macedonian Students and Young Professionals Happy Hour at the Opera Bar at the Sydney Opera House in Sydney. Let's mingle and network.
                      For comments, questions, concerns, please contact us at:

                      United Macedonian Diaspora
                      http://www.umdiaspora.org

                      1101 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, 6th Floor, Washington, D.C. 20004, United States
                      Phone: (202) 756-2244, Fax: (202) 756-7323, E-mail: info@umdiaspora.org

                      PO Box 2153, Hawthorn, Vic. 3122, Australia
                      Phone: 0438 385 466, E-mail: australia@umdiaspora.org

                      3555 St. Clair Avenue East, Toronto, ON, M1K 1L6, Canada
                      Phone: 416-209-0448, E-mail: canada@umdiaspora.org

                      Comment

                      • Bill77
                        Senior Member
                        • Oct 2009
                        • 4545

                        Originally posted by amitreski View Post
                        Pelister

                        In his speech Meto said that at the time he though Democratic seemed like a good option to solve the name issue and move on to work on the human rights issue for the Macedonians in greece, Bulgaria, Albania, work on economic development, cultural promotion, etc.

                        He admitted that he made a mistake and that right now he does not think he should have supported that change in the first place. Meto right now does not support ANY NAME CHANGE.

                        UMD HAS NEVER supported a name change, as you can see in many press releases and our resolution from the global conference.

                        Once again NO NAME CHANGE.
                        Meto Has to be Careful when he speaks in public regarding the Name issue. As a president of UMD, people see him wearing the UMD hat when he makes comments.

                        Unless he cleary stated "Its not The UMD position just my own opinion, that we should change the name" Then he would understandably be understood as speaking on UMD behalf, which i think he was clearly speaking on UMD (The Organisation) behalf.

                        There for, your statement that i highlited, "Meto said that at the time he though Democratic seemed like a good option" and " UMD HAS NEVER supported a name change" is some what hypocritical.



                        Regarding your Next post, 90% Macedonians suport EU integration.
                        That argument and figure is irelevant to this argument or issue.
                        What is relevant, is the figure how many would reject EU integration if we had to change the Name.
                        Last edited by Bill77; 02-12-2010, 08:07 PM.
                        http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=120873#post120873

                        Comment

                        • Prolet
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2009
                          • 5241

                          e) Macedonia agrees that the two parties will not “resolve” the name dispute through the International Court of Justice – i.e., Igor Janev’s proposal (Article 21).
                          Thats right, however article D was broken which there makes the agreement invalid.
                          МАКЕДОНЕЦ си кога кавал ќе ти ја распара душата,зурла ќе ти го раскине срцето,кога секое влакно од кожата ќе ти се наежи кога ќе видиш шеснаесеткрако сонце,кога до коска ќе те заболи кога ќе слушнеш ПЈРМ,кога немаш ни за леб,а полн си во душата затоа што ја сакаш МАКЕДОНИЈА. МАКЕДОНИЈА во срце те носиме.

                          Comment

                          • Pelister
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 2742

                            Originally posted by amitreski View Post
                            What anti-Macedonian institutions? NATO and EU? The same institutions that are supported by the Macedonians in The Republic of Macedonia by 90%?
                            I am talking about the policies, the processes and practices of the E.U and NATO institutions toward the Macedonians.

                            Are the terms Greece has put to the Macedonians acceptable to you? So why are they acceptable to the E.U and to NATO?

                            How do you explain the E.U insistence or NATO'S insistance on Macedonia "finding a solution" to what is an illegitimate dispute?

                            The "negotiations" and other Western processes are designed to get a few individuals to sign away or reject/renounce our identity for all time. How do you explain UMD's defence of these anti-Macedonian processes and the Western organizations that drive them?

                            If you can produce a poll that shows over 90% of Macedonians wanting to join the E.U, I"d like to see it. Even if you can it is not really addressing the critical issue which is not our entry into the E.U but the fact that we are negotiating our historical identity to do it.

                            The last poll showed that over 90% of Macedonians do not want the negotiations to continue.

                            The real issue is that there are forces and processes working to get us to renounce our historical identity.

                            In a typical UMD fashion once again you seem to be deflecting attention away from this critical point.

                            Comment

                            • Pelister
                              Senior Member
                              • Sep 2008
                              • 2742

                              If its not being supplied by UMD then it either does not exist or its too damaging to UMD to re-produce it.

                              Any idea when it might have been published if at all?

                              Comment

                              • Pelister
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2008
                                • 2742

                                Originally posted by amitreski View Post
                                No it is not.
                                If all the statements UMD have released defending the term FYROM, defending the negotiations, defending the Interim Accord, even berating Greece for not being serious about a name change - cannot be constituted as evidence of UMD's position, then what can?
                                Last edited by Pelister; 02-12-2010, 09:08 PM.

                                Comment

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