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-   -   Albanianization in Macedonia (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4837)

Risto the Great 01-10-2013 05:31 PM

Gocka, there is a reason why wars occur. Violence settles disputes in a way that diplomacy never will. You mention trying to find weaknesses. It is as plain as the USA flag in Kosovo. The ethnic Albanians are the minority in Macedonia. That is their weakness. Anyone would think it wasn't the case.

So minority rights that totally empower the individual should be pursued. Not the ones that empower a minority group.

With respect to name calling etc. I agree, it is childish and unnecessary. Sometimes many of us succumb to this because we have been in these dialogues for many years now. It gets tiresome. I try to avoid this as much as possible but there are occasions where you can only bang your head on a wall so many times. We had someone called vicsinad here recently. I'm positive he is a lovely guy in person. But he made it clear he was very much pro-Albanian rights and he did not find anything in the framework agreement particularly offensive but thought it was a problem and he completely favoured the Badinter principle as it applies in Macedonia. His ideology was poisonous in my opinion. It was wrong and unable to be argued positively in any useful fashion. How long would you give someone like that an open forum?

Gocka 01-10-2013 07:32 PM

[QUOTE=Risto the Great;138444]Gocka, there is a reason why wars occur. Violence settles disputes in a way that diplomacy never will. You mention trying to find weaknesses. It is as plain as the USA flag in Kosovo. The ethnic Albanians are the minority in Macedonia. That is their weakness. Anyone would think it wasn't the case.

So minority rights that totally empower the individual should be pursued. Not the ones that empower a minority group.

With respect to name calling etc. I agree, it is childish and unnecessary. Sometimes many of us succumb to this because we have been in these dialogues for many years now. It gets tiresome. I try to avoid this as much as possible but there are occasions where you can only bang your head on a wall so many times. We had someone called vicsinad here recently. I'm positive he is a lovely guy in person. But he made it clear he was very much pro-Albanian rights and he did not find anything in the framework agreement particularly offensive but thought it was a problem and he completely favoured the Badinter principle as it applies in Macedonia. His ideology was poisonous in my opinion. It was wrong and unable to be argued positively in any useful fashion. How long would you give someone like that an open forum?[/QUOTE]

Yes they are the minority but in this case oddly so it's actually an advantage. When you are a minority it is easy to make outrageous claims on the world stage and fly under the radar because everyone always assumes that as a majority that you are oppressing them. You can't assume the people around the world even most politicians know what's really going on in ROM. In the 21 century PR is everything and even the devil can be Jesus and vice versa if you give your opposition the chance to portray you that way.
War my friend never solved anything if it did the world wouldn't have any problems today, and they are the same that they always have been. is it 2013 or 1913? I can't tell the difference. We have had many wars in the Balkans and that is why things have never changed. So I respectfully disagree that war can solve anything. Genocide is the only kind of violence that would actually bring peace afterwards but would you be for that? Could you live with that? War only brings death and sets you back another hundred years. Besides I honestly think we would lose an armed conflict, as much as it hurts to say. Even if we won the battle we would have lost the war. We are too small of a country and population for that kind of carnage, we would never recover.
My approach is not diplomatic. I'm not a very diplomatic person I know what is right and wrong and there is no middle ground for me. I am for conflict but one in the shadows and in the minds not in the fields. I truly believe mans biggest enemy is himself. It doesn't take much to turn people against each other.
What you see now in ROM is only superficial. It's not hard to erect a flag or a statue or change a banner or a sign. Most of the things that infuriate us so much can be taken down faster than they were put up. Do you really think hanging a flag shows superiority? I don't but guess what they do, that only goes to show that we are really dealing with a bunch of rowdy children who have been given way to much encouragement by their puppet masters.
We are more intelligent then they are, and most importantly we are right. That is what the people in ROM should feel. We can beat them with our brains. We have to push their nationalistic terroristic islamist buttons and let them expose themselves for the filth that they are. We have to make the majority of Albanians in ROM see that this group of terrorists that are their leaders are not good for them and that they are better off with us then them. It is not that hard how hard is it to get a wolf to expose itself, just dangle a sheep and he can't help himself. I don't think they can help themselves either. They are egotistical drug dealers it won't take much to show them for what they are.
My gut feeling is that we can make them destroy themselves if we are strong and unified and act as a front. They are wrong on almost every level can it really be that hard to make it known? It's about winning the hearts and minds, a great man said something to that line and I think you know who I'm talking about
I apologize for the rant. I've never been able to talk to anyone about these matters. The NJ crowd aren't exactly your Patriot poster boys.

Niko777 01-15-2013 07:22 PM

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]Soon all of the public buses in Skopje will have bilingual (Albanian-Macedonian) electronic displays.[/COLOR][/U][/B]

[IMG]http://www.novamakedonija.com.mk/Uploads/NewsInstant/small/15012013134326_avtobusi%20jsp.jpg[/IMG]

Source: [url]http://www.dnevnik.com.mk/default.asp?ItemID=27EF0D5F3B64954188892437DDA027C8[/url]

Big Bad Sven 01-17-2013 12:06 AM

[QUOTE=Niko777;138540][B][U][COLOR="Red"]Soon all of the public buses in Skopje will have bilingual (Albanian-Macedonian) electronic displays.[/COLOR][/U][/B]

[IMG]http://www.novamakedonija.com.mk/Uploads/NewsInstant/small/15012013134326_avtobusi%20jsp.jpg[/IMG]

Source: [url]http://www.dnevnik.com.mk/default.asp?ItemID=27EF0D5F3B64954188892437DDA027C8[/url][/QUOTE]

Makedonijia is the Switzerland of the balkans now :tt2:

momce 01-17-2013 01:31 AM

Where are Macedonian rights in Albania? Greece, Bulgaria?

Niko777 01-17-2013 03:40 PM

[U][B][COLOR="Red"]Bilingual signs (like this one) have been installed all over "Plostad Makedonija" in Skopje[/COLOR][/B][/U]

[IMG]http://distilleryimage5.s3.amazonaws.com/0336005c581a11e288f622000a1fbc72_7.jpg[/IMG]

Risto the Great 01-18-2013 03:52 PM

The Albanians in Macedonia have the right to Revolt
 
[url]http://www.groundreport.com/Business/INA-The-Albanians-in-Macedonia-have-the-right-to-R/2949436[/url]


November 16, 2012

[QUOTE]
Albanian news agency INA days ago published a special article, which called Albanians in Macedonia to revolution.

Written material is Valbona Vardari. Citing the American writer and philosopher Henry David Thoreau, she pays particular attention to his book "On civil disobedience." Based on what is written in it, it makes a number of calls and recommendations prompted by the situation of Albanians in Macedonia.

Vardari believe that Albanian people in Macedonia is "in a state of endless misery under colonial occupation in FYROM and aggravated by political elites must take their fate into their own hands and stop in obedience to the government that is tyranny."

"This resistance against colonialism, and the antialbanic terrorist state is vital for the realization of freedom, so everyone has to work against the slavonic Government, so finally there can be achieved decolonization, self-determination and the right to a referendum on the establishment of a single nation-state called Albania, "the author writes.

The material finally ends with a call - 'act and fight against the colonial slavonic-macedonic power for the freedom of your children. "[/QUOTE]

Where does one begin?

This comment sums it up:
[QUOTE]Ethnic Macedonians have far more reason to revolt in Macedonia than the ethnic Albanians who enjoy disproportionate rights bestowed upon them through the Framework Agreement.[/QUOTE]

George S. 01-18-2013 06:03 PM

the thing that has albanians going is a notion of a greater albania & they want to replace macedonia with that by any means.So the moral there is stand up to them before it's too late maybe it is too late but a defeatist attitude is not what we want...They the albanians cannot be allowed to continue unabatted.it's all happening over again like a movie the same like kosovo.

Big Bad Sven 01-21-2013 12:09 PM

I found it pretty funny that she said the macedonians were the colonists

Kumanovo and Kicevo says hi

George S. 01-21-2013 03:34 PM

if stupidity was a prize then the albanians win it umanimously.What reason do the albanians have a right to revolt.If anything they should take up arms agains't their own country albania .The reason for that is a lot of albanians were expelled after the 2nworld war By enver hoxer.In other words the communists in albania threw out the extreme element.They ended up as scum in macedonia.Demanding all sorts of rights & priveleges way above a normal citizen.There is no legitimate reason to revolt unless there is a greater albania reason.


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