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-   -   Albanianization in Macedonia (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4837)

Albo 01-25-2019 10:42 PM

[QUOTE] Albo you should direct your comments and complaints to the offices of DUI or other Albanian political representatives. [/QUOTE]

Yes they are also to blame.. but this village falls under the jurisdiction of Kumanovo municipality which has been ruled by Macedonian Mayors from both parties since independence, it's a local issue where funds need to be requested to central authorities from the local level.

[QUOTE]
For starters, you assume government responsibility for education.* [/QUOTE]
Is this wrong?
ALL public schools in Macedonia are funded by the government.


[QUOTE] Secondly, you assume all citizens pay tax, and if they do, that they pay the full amount that they are required to. [/QUOTE]

So your assuming that they don't or haven't paid enough tax over the years to deserve a simple small school?

[QUOTE]
Thirdly, you assume all Macedonian schools are funded by the state, and if they are, that they're funded adequately [/QUOTE]

I haven't seen a case where the local population has funded a school in Macedonian communities because the state hasn't!

The funding of things like schools, local roads, drainage, sewage Drinking water, basic infrastructure have been funded by (mostly the Albanian diaspora) in Albanian regions since independence! This isn't a first.. there are countless stories of money being collected for basic needs that are the responsibility of the government,

I'm not saying macedonian regions are perfect.. but I haven't seen hardly any cases of where the local communities have payed for basic infrastructure as Albanians have for decades!


[QUOTE] Fifthly, you assume that education in your "mother tongue" while living in a foreign country is somehow a right. [/QUOTE]

"FOREIGN COUNTRY" ??
How is it a foriegn country when you are talking about the land of your forefathers?

The land in which you are a citizen of!

The land of a Multi cultural country and society since the term Macedonia has existed!

The land where one contributes taxes too!

The land where you own property that has been passed down over generations!

The land where your family has fought and died for eg (partisans) Yes many were Albanian - which people tend to either ignore or don't care that Albania blood was also split during the creation of the first Macedonian republic!

Ect ect ..I could go on and on..
The idea of Macedonia has never been a mono ethnic homogeneous state!
We as Albanians have the right to remain Albanian WITHOUT THE NEED TO ASSIMILATE - We have no need or want to assimilate!


[QUOTE]
I haven't watched your video link, but if its an example of Albanians been assimilated into the culture of the country in which they live, then that is excellent news! This is the natural order of things. [/QUOTE]

So you would agree and are happy with the process of assimilation that has occurred to ethnic Macedonians in other Balkan countries?
Is that GREAT NEWS? as you say!

[QUOTE] Given that Albanians have supposedly lived in Macedonia for centuries [/QUOTE]
How is it that they have " supposedly" lived in Macedonia for centuries?

Spirit 01-25-2019 11:28 PM

[QUOTE=Albo;178744]Yes they are also to blame.. but this village falls under the jurisdiction of Kumanovo municipality which has been ruled by Macedonian Mayors from both parties since independence, it's a local issue where funds need to be requested to central authorities from the local level.


Is this wrong?
ALL public schools in Macedonia are funded by the government.




So your assuming that they don't or haven't paid enough tax over the years to deserve a simple small school?



I haven't seen a case where the local population has funded a school in Macedonian communities because the state hasn't!

The funding of things like schools, local roads, drainage, sewage Drinking water, basic infrastructure have been funded by (mostly the Albanian diaspora) in Albanian regions since independence! This isn't a first.. there are countless stories of money being collected for basic needs that are the responsibility of the government,

I'm not saying macedonian regions are perfect.. but I haven't seen hardly any cases of where the local communities have payed for basic infrastructure as Albanians have for decades!




"FOREIGN COUNTRY" ??
How is it a foriegn country when you are talking about the land of your forefathers?

The land in which you are a citizen of!

The land of a Multi cultural country and society since the term Macedonia has existed!

The land where one contributes taxes too!

The land where you own property that has been passed down over generations!

The land where your family has fought and died for eg (partisans) Yes many were Albanian - which people tend to either ignore or don't care that Albania blood was also split during the creation of the first Macedonian republic!

Ect ect ..I could go on and on..
The idea of Macedonia has never been a mono ethnic homogeneous state!
We as Albanians have the right to remain Albanian WITHOUT THE NEED TO ASSIMILATE - We have no need or want to assimilate!




So you would agree and are happy with the process of assimilation that has occurred to ethnic Macedonians in other Balkan countries?
Is that GREAT NEWS? as you say!


How is it that they have " supposedly" lived in Macedonia for centuries?[/QUOTE]

FUCKWIT, Albanians do have the right to remain Albanian in Macedonia, no one is denying that.
My parents migrated to Australia, they kept their identity and ethnicity as Macedonian but they integrated into Australian society, learning English, integrating into Australian society etc while retaining their culture as have many ethnicities here.
Most of the Albanians in Macedonia chose not to integrate and cry poor victim yet Albanians in Macedonia have more rights than most minorities in other countries, in fact Albanians in Macedonia have the best rights afforded to a minority in Europe. Do Macedonians in Albania have the same rights that Albanians in Macedonia have, after all they have lived there for centuries and it is their ancestral homelands as well. No they donít
Idiot, and normally I donít resort to name calling but you are a fucking hypocrite and should just fuck of from this forum

Niko777 02-03-2019 02:52 PM

[B][COLOR="Red"][U]Hitler fridge magnets, just one of many Albanian souvenirs available to purchase in central Skopje[/U][/COLOR][/B]

[IMG]https://telma.com.mk/wp-content/uploads/bfi_thumb/hitler-skopje-37vxiwid4m6muda4ie2v40.jpg[/IMG]

Risto the Great 02-03-2019 03:57 PM

Look at the opportunism of these people. They became whores for Hitler, Wilson, Clinton et al. They became Muslims to gain unfettered access to Macedonian lands. They became Greeks. They have a tendency to become criminals. It's like watching lab rats in action when they are in a new environment.

Carlin 02-03-2019 11:05 PM

I disagree with generalizations and some of the views expressed against the Albanians. It is no better than how the average Greeks view and treat Macedonians (as in the opinions we just read about in Neos Kosmos).

I think we can all rise above it, and treat each other with respect and honour.

FYI - Note about my family history:

- My ancestors were expelled from the Moschopole area by Muslim Albanians;
- Prior to that, as per tradition (which is possibly inaccurate, because this goes back to before Moschopole), my ancestors were driven from area just north of Ioannina by Muslim Albanian bands;
- More recently, late 19th/early 20th century my ancestors and their villages were frequently and repeatedly attacked/ransacked by Muslim Albanian kachak bands, completely unprovoked. (There was a murder/killing recorded.) In one famous case, the local Arman Orthodox populace organized themselves and fought back, recapturing the stolen goods as well as dealing a severe blow to the kachak band. There was a poem written/recorded which some years after even Albanians themselves translated into Albanian, and admired the heroism of these people (especially a couple of leaders) who fought on their own against the kachaks.

Soldier of Macedon 02-03-2019 11:47 PM

[QUOTE="Albo"]The land where your family has fought and died for eg (partisans) Yes many were Albanian - which people tend to either ignore or don't care that Albania blood was also split during the creation of the first Macedonian republic![/QUOTE]
Some would argue that the first Macedonian republic was established in Krusevo during the Ilinden Uprising, where the overwhelming majority of ethnic Albanians that were complicit or involved as combatants fought against the Macedonians. As for WWII, do you believe there were more ethnic Albanians from Macedonia who fought as partisans with the aim of creating a Macedonian republic as opposed to those who were fighting to create a "greater" Albania?
[QUOTE]How is it a foriegn country when you are talking about the land of your forefathers?[/QUOTE]
Careful, you only need to go back a few centuries (or less in some cases) where the above argument becomes increasingly useless. Not to mention the manner in which it came to be.
[QUOTE]The land of a Multi cultural country and society since the term Macedonia has existed![/QUOTE]
Is Albania a multi cultural country?
[QUOTE=Carlin15;179083]I disagree with generalizations and some of the views expressed against the Albanians. It is no better than how the average Greeks view and treat Macedonians (as in the opinions we just read about in Neos Kosmos).[/QUOTE]
Generalisations aren't always helpful. Which views specifically do you disagree with and which of them are comparable with average Greek attitudes towards Macedonians?

Carlin 02-04-2019 12:04 AM

Well generalizations such as that they are all criminals and similar (also name calling).

Liberator of Makedonija 02-04-2019 12:40 AM

[QUOTE=Soldier of Macedon;179087]Some would argue that the first Macedonian republic was established in Krusevo during the Ilinden Uprising, where the overwhelming majority of ethnic Albanians that were complicit or involved as combatants fought against the Macedonians. As for WWII, do you believe there were more ethnic Albanians from Macedonia who fought as partisans with the aim of creating a Macedonian republic as opposed to those who were fighting to create a "greater" Albania?[/QUOTE]

This one is worth investigating as there were Albanian brigades in the NLA and there were Albanians present at ASNOM.

Soldier of Macedon 02-04-2019 01:36 AM

[QUOTE=Liberator of Makedonija;179094]This one is worth investigating as there were Albanian brigades in the NLA and there were Albanians present at ASNOM.[/QUOTE]
The period in reference is WWII. I was juxtaposing ethnic Albanians from Macedonia who served as Macedonian Partisans with ethnic Albanians from Macedonia who served in the Balli Kombetar.
[QUOTE=Carlin15;179089]Well generalizations such as that they are all criminals and similar (also name calling).[/QUOTE]
Such generalisations based on stereotypes that some ethnic Albanians promote themselves can hardly be compared to the rabid racism exhibited by many Greeks towards Macedonians simply for existing.

Risto the Great 02-04-2019 02:25 AM

[QUOTE=Carlin15;179083]I disagree with generalizations and some of the views expressed against the Albanians. It is no better than how the average Greeks view and treat Macedonians (as in the opinions we just read about in Neos Kosmos).

I think we can all rise above it, and treat each other with respect and honour.

FYI - Note about my family history:

- My ancestors were expelled from the Moschopole area by Muslim Albanians;
- Prior to that, as per tradition (which is possibly inaccurate, because this goes back to before Moschopole), my ancestors were driven from area just north of Ioannina by Muslim Albanian bands;
- More recently, late 19th/early 20th century my ancestors and their villages were frequently and repeatedly attacked/ransacked by Muslim Albanian kachak bands, completely unprovoked. (There was a murder/killing recorded.) In one famous case, the local Arman Orthodox populace organized themselves and fought back, recapturing the stolen goods as well as dealing a severe blow to the kachak band. There was a poem written/recorded which some years after even Albanians themselves translated into Albanian, and admired the heroism of these people (especially a couple of leaders) who fought on their own against the kachaks.[/QUOTE]I think (based on the above) they [I]generally[/I] like to invade.

They are an opportunistic people. Sure, that is a generalisation. It could even be understood to be a compliment. Like Negroids are thought to be more athletic than Caucasians. Macedonians didn't change religion en masse simply to seize upon benefits conferred to Muslims. Albanians did. The level of criminality is clear and this is another (less savoury) side of the opportunism present in the Albanian race. Albanians seem to be more industrious and resourceful than their neighbours in the region. History supports this argument.


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