Flags/Banners of Macedonia
 

Thought this forum could use a thread dedicated to flags and banners used by us Macedonians, especially those of četi from years gone by.

I'll start off simple:

Flag of the Kruševo četa during the Ilinden Uprising, also the flag of the Kruševo Republic

[IMG]https://vgy.me/HdMZec.png[/IMG]
[IMG]https://vgy.me/NGxauf.jpg[/IMG]

Flag of the Ohrid četa

[IMG]https://vgy.me/kjvq6k.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]https://vgy.me/7tDZPd.jpg[/IMG]

Flag of the Struga četa

[IMG]https://vgy.me/ioeecH.jpg[/IMG]

Flag from Zagoričani (Kostursko) during the time of the Ilinden Uprising

[IMG]https://vgy.me/y5ysdK.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Liberator of Makedonija;174823]

Flag from Zagoričani (Kostursko) during the time of the Ilinden Uprising

[IMG]https://vgy.me/y5ysdK.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Color photo

Notice on the bottom it says "20 July 1903" - the real date of Ilinden

[IMG]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-noM71lMdXao/UBl4uRC7f6I/AAAAAAAAA0k/HXgwjQB1WQc/s1600/zagorichani+flag.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=Niko777;174843]Color photo

Notice on the bottom it says "20 July 1903" - the real date of Ilinden

[IMG]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-noM71lMdXao/UBl4uRC7f6I/AAAAAAAAA0k/HXgwjQB1WQc/s1600/zagorichani+flag.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Do you know if thats the original colouring or a recolour?

[QUOTE=Niko777;174843]Notice on the bottom it says "20 July 1903" - the real date of Ilinden[/QUOTE]
Just to clarify something about the 'real' date. The Gregorian calendar, which is what modern states use today, leaps forward from the original Julian calendar (which is approximately 1,600 years older) by almost two weeks. In Ottoman times, which is when this flag was made, we used the Julian calendar exclusively. Our church today still does for actual religious dates, but it superficially applies the Gregorian calendar dates. For instance, we still celebrate Ilinden on 20 July according to the Julian calendar, but on the same day it is 2 August in the Gregorian calendar. Same for Christmas, we celebrate it on 25 December according to the Julian calendar but on the same day it is 7 January in the Gregorian calendar. This is why I find it a little odd that our people in Ovčarani celebrate Ilinden on 20 July of the Gregorian calendar, because it's about two weeks earlier than the actual date according to the Julian calendar used by Orthodox Christians (including Macedonians during the Ilinden Uprising and prior to the usurpation of their lands by the Greek state). This is my understanding. I'm not an expert on this topic so if I have mistaken something anybody can feel free to correct it.

I'm no expert either but, if I was to hazard a guess, I think it has something to do with the communist atheist ideology of the time (i.e. in 1944/45) who, on the one hand, felt the need to commemorate the Macedonian people's uprising against the Turks and, on the other, break all ties with the Orthodox church. The modern equivalent of the Orthodox calendar date for Ilinden, 2nd of August, commemorates the Ilinden Uprising without tying it to the Orthodox Church. That's my take on it anyway.

Would it be better to go the way of Ovcharani and other Aegean Macedonian villages who celebrate Ilinden on 20th of July?...I'm not sure but I wouldn't be opposed to it ether way.

[QUOTE=Soldier of Macedon;174863]For instance, we still celebrate Ilinden on 20 July according to the Julian calendar, but on the same day it is 2 August in the Gregorian calendar. Same for Christmas, we celebrate it on 25 December according to the Julian calendar but on the same day it is 7 January in the Gregorian calendar. [/QUOTE]

Yes you have it completely right. Most Macedonians I've talked to don't know that on August 2nd it's actually July 20 on the Macedonian Orthodox Calendar. And they don't know that when Ilinden took place, it was July 20th to them, the Ilindenci.

[QUOTE=Liberator of Makedonija;174860]Do you know if thats the original colouring or a recolour?[/QUOTE]

Looks original to me, but I'm not an expert.

[QUOTE=Niko777;174875]Looks original to me, but I'm not an expert.[/QUOTE]

That colour pattern raises questions for me.

[QUOTE=Liberator of Makedonija;174881]That colour pattern raises questions for me.[/QUOTE]

Thе flag looks typical of a photo that has undergone colorisation as opposed to decolorisation. The washed out colours not withstanding, there are red and green artefacts extending beyond the tassels themselves which, in my opinion, are not attributable to noise. The inconsistency is most noticeable in the colorisation of the top right tassel when compared to the decolorised image and even the shape of the bottom right tassel is is different in both images.