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-   -   Albanianization in Macedonia (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4837)

Niko777 11-30-2010 06:58 PM

Albanianization and Islamization in Macedonia
 
Look what was happening in Kumanovo this week:

[IMG]http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQlpGWRUWQBnHUQ6zK9dCi3EPN-aX4U9H5bdUuTzSmAGr9F7AjkXEa4WGhnEw[/IMG]



Albanians in Macedonia have way too many rights, and I believe these rights will endanger the sovereignty and unity of Macedonia. Albanian nationalism in Macedonia has been rising since 2001 thanks to that stupid framework agreement. Now every year on November 28 Macedonia celebrates "Albanian National Flag day". WTF. This isn't what our ancestors and the Ilindenci had in mind when they envisioned a Macedonian Republic. I can only blame Macedonian politicians for allowing and fostering an environment suitable for Albanian nationalism to expand.

Let's quickly look at some of the flaws that will cost Macedonia big one day:

- Albanian flag allowed to be flown on Macedonian government municipal buildings, and streets of cities with Albanian minority population.

-Students of Albanian origin are separated from Macedonian students in classes

-Albanian textbooks for the students are flawed, for example, they are not just an Albanian translation of the Macedonian books, they are totally different books in that they focus on Albania and history of the Albanian people (in Albania). I remember seeing an Albanian elementary school book that are used in Macedonia from that Macedonian Ministry website. In it, it showed some children illustrations of kids talking to each other saying something like "Hi, my name is Ismail and I am an Albanian from Kosovo, Hi my name is Habib and I am from Albania, and one from Macedonia, but together we are all Albanians". WTF how will this help Macedonia? Look at the message these children are taught from a young age.

- Albanian students are taught Albanian and English from the first grade, Macedonian is taught from the fourth grade but only as a second language which means that math, history, biology, and all the scientific vocabulary are taught in the Albanian language. How the fu** is this supposed to integrate Albanians into Macedonian society? And why is English being taught before Macedonian?

-Mosques are popping up in Macedonia like weeds. For example in Skopje there are like 30+ mosques and only a few churches, but 75% of Skopje is apparently Christian. This means that mosques are being built solely for political purposes by Albanian groups, sometimes without the appropriate documentation or permits yet the Macedonian government isn't doing anything about it. In fact, it is probably easier to build a mosque than it is to build a church in Macedonia (legally).

-the law that changed municipal borders to make Albanians the majority in places like Struga was a disaster for Macedonia. Why is the government looking after the interests of Albanians before the Macedonians?

-I remember reading a news article a couple of months ago that said out of the 300 newly hired government workers in Maceonia, 99% are Albanians, because of the new law that requires bilingualism in the Albanian language.

-Let's not forget the new "Skenderbeu Square" proposed for the center of Skopje, it was approved by the Macedonian government, and according to the details it will be significantly larger than "Macedonia Square" and it is supposed to be the new meeting place for the city.

-Albanians in the Macedonian government are every week in Albania or Kosovo collaborating with Albanian politicians and signing agreements.

-I could go on and on.

I guess what I am trying to say is that after the Republic of Macedonia won independence in 1991, you would have expected a process of Macedonianization to take place in the country. Just look at the policies in Albania, Greece, Bulgaria, and Serbia. But this is not happening in Macedonia, instead I get the feeling that Macedonia as a state is working in favor of the Albanian people, instead of the Macedonian population (Albanianization).

Bill77 11-30-2010 07:12 PM

[QUOTE=Niko777;80435]

Albanians in Macedonia have way too many rights, and I believe these rights will endanger the sovereignty and unity of Macedonia. Albanian nationalism in Macedonia has been rising since 2001 thanks to that stupid framework agreement. Now every year on November 28 Macedonia celebrates "Albanian National Flag day". WTF. This isn't what our ancestors and the Ilindenci had in mind when they envisioned a Macedonian Republic. [B]I can only blame Macedonian politicians [/B]for allowing and fostering an environment suitable for Albanian nationalism to expand. [/QUOTE] Thats the easy way out blaming the government and frankly, i am getting sick of Macedonians around the world not taking full responsibility of what's happening to Macedonia.
Its clearly the Macedonian citizens and Diaspora's fault for everything.

By the way, Where are those Kumanovski pitchki that were throwing the eggs on our statues a few days ago?

Niko777 11-30-2010 07:16 PM

[QUOTE]Thats the easy way out blaming the government and frankly, i am getting sick of Macedonians around the world not taking full responsibility of what's happening to Macedonia.
Its clearly the Macedonian citizens and Diaspora's fault for everything.

By the way, Where are those Kumanovski pitchki that were throwing the eggs on our statues a few days ago?[/QUOTE]

Yes of course Macedonian citizens are also to blame!

Niko777 11-30-2010 07:18 PM

[B][COLOR="Red"][U]I urge everyone here to take a look at the Macedonian school book for 4th graders for students of Albanian origin:[/U][/COLOR][/B]

[url]http://issuu.com/e-ucebnici/docs/gjuha_4_maq_ok?mode=embed&layout=http://e-ucebnici.mk/issuu/theme/layout.xml&showFlipBtn=true[/url]


[B][U]On the top bar type in page 133 (out of 152 pages). Students are taught the national anthem of the Republic of Albania and the history of it!!!! In the 4th grade! They are NOT taught the Macedonian anthem!!![/U][/B]

Niko777 11-30-2010 07:29 PM

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]Take a look at this book, the Albanian language for the 6th grade.[/COLOR][/U][/B]

[url]http://issuu.com/e-ucebnici/docs/albanski_jazik_6_k2?mode=embed&layout=http://e-ucebnici.mk/issuu/theme/layout.xml&showFlipBtn=true[/url]

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]Look at page 5, there is a map of a GREATER ALBANIA! In a Macedonian government published school book! Shame![/COLOR][/U][/B]

Risto the Great 11-30-2010 07:59 PM

Niko777, thank you for depressing the hell out of me.

Vangelovski 11-30-2010 08:39 PM

Niko777,

Thanks for the links to the textbooks. This is the Framework Agreement in action. This is what Gruevski has implemented and this is what the UMD puppets support.

Vangelovski 11-30-2010 08:42 PM

[quote=Niko777;80441]Take a look at this book, the Albanian language for the 6th grade.

[URL="http://issuu.com/e-ucebnici/docs/albanski_jazik_6_k2?mode=embed&layout=http://e-ucebnici.mk/issuu/theme/layout.xml&showFlipBtn=true"][url]http://issuu.com/e-ucebnici/docs/albanski_jazik_6_k2?mode=embed&layout=http://e-ucebnici.mk/issuu/theme/layout.xml&showFlipBtn=true[/url][/URL]

Look at page 5, there is a map of a GREATER ALBANIA! In a Macedonian government published school book! Shame![/quote]

The 'language tree' on p. 3 does not even include Macedonian.

indigen 11-30-2010 08:49 PM

[QUOTE=Bill77;80436]Thats the easy way out blaming the government and frankly, i am getting sick of Macedonians around the world not taking full responsibility of what's happening to Macedonia.
[SIZE="4"][COLOR="Red"]Its clearly the Macedonian citizens and Diaspora's fault for everything.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/QUOTE]
FLAWED RATIONALE AND UNDERSTANDING OF HOW POLITICS WORKS! Read my signature file below and visit the link for gerater understanding of how the state has a hand in engineering either patriotic or (in Macedonia's case) spineless (безр’бетници - мекотели!) individuals.

indigen 11-30-2010 09:06 PM

[QUOTE=Risto the Great;80447]Niko777, thank you for depressing the hell out of me.[/QUOTE]

Yes, mate, MACEDONIAN REALITY IS DEPRESSING but it is better to know the BITTER TRUTH than to live in a DELUSIONAL WORLD where MACEDONIA IS JUST GREAT AND THAT WE ARE WINNING IN EVERY LEVEL!

Also, it is good to have Niko777 come on the MTO and preach REALITY politics rather than delusional and diversionary politics of how Gruevski and "UMD" are going to win the day for the Macedonian Cause.

Prolet 11-30-2010 09:39 PM

Its absolutely disgusting watching that, i think Education Minister Todorov needs to take a look at the Albanian Uchebnik.

Za Sramota :nono:

Niko777 11-30-2010 09:55 PM

[QUOTE]it is better to know the BITTER TRUTH than to live in a DELUSIONAL WORLD where MACEDONIA IS JUST GREAT AND THAT WE ARE WINNING IN EVERY LEVEL![/QUOTE]
Yes, this was exactly my aim, not to depress people (sorry Risto) but to give a wake up call to all those living in the delusional dream world.

BTW I will probably post more in this thread from time to time.

makedonche 11-30-2010 10:14 PM

Niko777

Welcome, keep posting! The more realistic picture the better!

julie 12-01-2010 01:53 AM

Welcome to the MTO Niko 777, and thank you for the posts. I agree with RTG it is depressing, but its reality, the framework agreement in action

Volk 12-01-2010 02:32 AM

revolting.... outcome of the political capitulation in 2001.

de-facto federalization...

Remember 97?? Mayor of gostivar was arrested and anti riot police put down protesters.. why?? because they raised the albanian flag... This was under Gligorov by the way...

Look at things now

Risto the Great 12-01-2010 02:36 AM

[QUOTE=Volk;80488]Look at things now[/QUOTE]
Some might call it progress. We are looking better to the EU every day.

Bill77 12-01-2010 06:04 AM

[QUOTE=indigen;80456]FLAWED RATIONALE AND UNDERSTANDING OF HOW POLITICS WORKS! Read my signature file below and visit the link for gerater understanding of how the state has a hand in engineering either patriotic or (in Macedonia's case) spineless (безр’бетници - мекотели!) individuals.[/QUOTE]In that case, it would also be FLAWED RATIONALE to blame Gruevski or Crvenkovski who were also once ordinary citizens that would have been engineered by this State.

Come on mate, You can give me reasons why people don't rebel, but the fact that we must take matter into our own hands instead of relying on politicians is not a Flawed Rational.

Speaking of spineless, i "use to" have a cousin who lives in Australia, when telling a greek that he is Macedonian, he would then add "oh i'm not the typical type of Macedonian".
And how many Diaspora Macedonians are afraid to call them selves Macedonians.

Now how has this "State" engineered these Macedonians on the other side of the planet, to become so spineless?

indigen 12-01-2010 06:36 AM

[QUOTE=Bill77;80514]In that case, it would also be FLAWED RATIONALE to blame Gruevski or Crvenkovski who were also once ordinary citizens that would have been engineered by this State.[/quote]
No it is not! They are now (and have been for a while) part of the VASSAL SYSTEM ENJOYING THE BENEFITS OF VASSALAGE! :-)

[QUOTE]Come on mate, You can give me reasons why people don't rebel, [COLOR="Red"][B]but the fact that we must take matter into our own hands instead of relying on politicians is not a Flawed Rational.[/B][/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
True!

[QUOTE]Speaking of spineless, i "use to" have a cousin who lives in Australia, when telling a greek that he is Macedonian, he would then add "oh i'm not the typical type of Macedonian".
And how many Diaspora Macedonians are afraid to call them selves Macedonians.[/QUOTE]
Many used to call themselves "YUgoSLAV/ian and probably those are the many that are afraid to do so. But there were many examples of Macedonians clashing with Grks as supporters of football teams in the late 1980s and early 1990s and those Macedonians surely did not show any gene deficiencies to make them lack courage to fight (in fact they were acting like Macedonian lions!). :-)

[QUOTE]Now how has this "State" engineered these Macedonians on the other side of the planet, to become so spineless?[/QUOTE]
Good subject for a future topic discussion, Bill! Save it for next year and see if we can shed more light on it then but the extended arm of the state should not be discounted, even more so today with internet access readily available, daily news satellite TV broadcasts and ethnic radio that has been around for 30 plus years.

Prolet 12-01-2010 08:13 AM

[QUOTE=Volk;80488]

Remember 97??

Look at things now[/QUOTE]

Volk, Who gave the Albanians from Kosovo 150,000 Citizenships? Kiro Gligorov did more harm then good.

protivpropaganda 12-01-2010 10:21 AM

While reading the posts on this thread I got an eiry feeling that I was going to be albanised tomorrow and there wasn't anything I could have done to stop it.

Be scared you feeble Macedonian!
Be scared since you do not have two hands to fight back. You do not have a mind of your own. There isn't anything you can do to stop the unstoppable super albanians so why try? Just lay down and die it is for the best anyway... Whose best is a totally different question.

All the info on what everybody is doing to us is just a scare tactic.
Scare tactics work on two levels.
One is to scare then to offer a solution. In this way the one that uses the scare tactic can sell anything for relief of the fright caused.
The other is to scare but not to offer a solution which inevitably leads to apathy in the target.

For further reading:
[url]http://www.angelfire.com/ab6/protivpropaganda/fajlovi/strav.htm[/url]

Volk 12-01-2010 10:40 AM

[QUOTE]Volk, Who gave the Albanians from Kosovo 150,000 Citizenships? Kiro Gligorov did more harm then good.[/QUOTE]

Crvenkovski??

julie 12-01-2010 11:56 AM

[QUOTE=protivpropaganda;80545]While reading the posts on this thread I got an eiry feeling that I was going to be albanised tomorrow and there wasn't anything I could have done to stop it.

Be scared you feeble Macedonian!
Be scared since you do not have two hands to fight back. You do not have a mind of your own. There isn't anything you can do to stop the unstoppable super albanians so why try? Just lay down and die it is for the best anyway... Whose best is a totally different question.

All the info on what everybody is doing to us is just a scare tactic.
Scare tactics work on two levels.
One is to scare then to offer a solution. In this way the one that uses the scare tactic can sell anything for relief of the fright caused.
The other is to scare but not to offer a solution which inevitably leads to apathy in the target.

For further reading:
[url]http://www.angelfire.com/ab6/protivpropaganda/fajlovi/strav.htm[/url][/QUOTE]

I have many questions, firstly welcome to the MTO.
Am unsure of where you are heading, in fact , whether you are a Macedonian or an Albanian posing as one,

Why did MACEDONIANS allow the enforcement of the framework agreement?
Why did Macedonians allow the change in the flag?
Why did MaCEDONIANS allow an Albanian criminal that headed terrorist groups in parliament (Ahmeti) ?
Why do MACEDONIANS continue to negotiate our name?
Why do MaCEDONIANS insist on using goodwill to offer soldiers to NATO under that revolting acronym? Knowing full well NATO will never enter allow anything but fyrom )it pains me to write it
Why do Macedonians insist on giving up everything in the 21st century just to gain enr into EU (who will give Macedonia a lovely debt to pay off Greece debt ??(

That is the start of some of my questions in response to your post

fyrOM 12-01-2010 04:58 PM

Thanks protivepropaganda for your suggestion which could have been summed up by the word scaremongering but you offer no evidence this is the case on this site…you neither discredit the concerns expressed as being nonexistent nor if they do exist attempt to explain why you think they are exaggerated.

I personally still hold the view that the government will not change the name despite their political doublespeak but I am more concerned with the other pressing issue of the Albanian separatists. They have taken concrete progressive steps towards their end. If action is not taken soon to abate the situation later action will only have to be more severe…probably by armed conflict.

Niko777 12-01-2010 05:55 PM

SIGNS in Macedonia:

In Skopje's historic center. What was the purpose of the Albanian version? What is the goal here? It's like "First we will call the Albanian population, then the Macedonians, and finally at last we will call foreign tourists to Skopje's historic monuments." Obviously, attracting tourists was not the goal here when they installed this sign:

[IMG]http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/3233/skopjecarsija.jpg[/IMG]


Street Signs in Skopje. English versions have been replaced with Albanian:

[URL=http://img146.imageshack.us/i/1111vq.jpg/][IMG]http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/125/1111vq.jpg[/IMG][/URL]


Skopje ZOO. This is pathetic. The Albanian name of every animal at the zoo, along with the Albanian flag, has been added for all of the animals at the Skopje Zoo. What would have happened if there was no Albanian flag or Albanian word for "Jaguar"? Is the Albanian language going to become extinct? Again, politics is involved here:

[URL=http://img228.imageshack.us/i/1111yg.jpg/][IMG]http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/566/1111yg.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

Schools are being renamed. This elementary school in Skopje was called "Edinstvo", now it has been renamed with the Albanian word "Fidani"

[IMG]http://www.cair.gov.mk/upload/images/1289592912.jpeg[/IMG]

The Macedonian government is building sports halls across the country. In the Tetovo area, a new sports hall was built with the name LIRIA. This is the Albanian word for "Freedom" (what kind of freedom?). But notice that the Macedonian version is not "Sloboda", it is still in Albanian but with Cyrillic.

[IMG]http://www.netpress.com.mk/sport/vestiimages/10720/12345.jpg[/IMG]

fyrOM 12-01-2010 06:17 PM

Bad signs Niko777. Thanks for posting them. This is too much. It is common to put English last…its kind of convenient also as you know to just look for he last line…but it is also common to put the state language first followed by any other secondary language in use. As it stands I implies Albanian is the state language.

Niko777 12-01-2010 06:23 PM

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]This post is very serious.[/COLOR][/U][/B] Just a warning that it might make you very upset. It is a propaganda video that targets young children of Albanian origin. BUT the worst part is, it was produced in part by school teachers and students from Macedonian Public schools in Skopje. It was released back when the Skenderbeg statue was built in Skopje few years ago.

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R45F89jWJ84]YouTube - Skenderbeu[/url]

Bill77 12-01-2010 06:49 PM

Niko, sorry for momentarily taking people away from your important post just above this one, but i want to ask if anyone has noticed the other Irony, in this Photo from your first post.

CLUE: Flag[B]s[/B].

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/44335903.jpg[/IMG]





OK, Back to post 26 by Niko.

[QUOTE=Niko777;80577][B][U][COLOR="Red"]This post is very serious.[/COLOR][/U][/B] Just a warning that it might make you very upset. It is a propaganda video that targets young children of Albanian origin. BUT the worst part is, it was produced in part by school teachers and students from Macedonian Public schools in Skopje. It was released back when the Skenderbeg statue was built in Skopje few years ago.

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R45F89jWJ84]YouTube - Skenderbeu[/url][/QUOTE]

Niko777 12-01-2010 07:02 PM

[QUOTE]Niko, sorry for momentarily taking people away from your important post just above this one, but i want to ask if anyone has noticed the other Irony, in this Photo from your first post.
[/QUOTE]

Ahh yes, I was also wondering if anyone else noticed the irony. It's a shame when you think about it, that the government is spending tens of thousands of euros installing these massive Macedonian flag poles. BTW did you know that they were installed in every major Macedonian city EXCEPT Tetovo and Gostivar? (If they had installed them in those two cities, they would have had to match it with an equally as big Albanian flag, just like in Kumanovo)

Prolet 12-01-2010 07:37 PM

Volk, Crvenkovski was Premier, Gligorov was President.

Here is another slap in the face, the head Reis Sulejman Efendi Redzepi the head of IVZ openly supports Macedonia becoming cantonized and becoming like Switzerland. If this is not a slap in the face to any Macedonian i dont know what is, and he openly states it on video.

[url]http://sitel.com.mk/video/makedonija/ivz-ja-blagoslovi-kantonizacijata-na-makedonija[/url]

Jankovska 12-01-2010 07:40 PM

[QUOTE=protivpropaganda;80545]While reading the posts on this thread I got an eiry feeling that I was going to be albanised tomorrow and there wasn't anything I could have done to stop it.

Be scared you feeble Macedonian!
Be scared since you do not have two hands to fight back. You do not have a mind of your own. There isn't anything you can do to stop the unstoppable super albanians so why try? Just lay down and die it is for the best anyway... Whose best is a totally different question.

All the info on what everybody is doing to us is just a scare tactic.
Scare tactics work on two levels.
One is to scare then to offer a solution. In this way the one that uses the scare tactic can sell anything for relief of the fright caused.
The other is to scare but not to offer a solution which inevitably leads to apathy in the target.

For further reading:
[url]http://www.angelfire.com/ab6/protivpropaganda/fajlovi/strav.htm[/url][/QUOTE]

Scare tactic? When was the last time you went to Kumanovo, Skopje, don't get me started on Tetovo, Gostivar, Kicevo? You should be scared and every Macedonian should be scared. In Tetovo and gostivar you cannot find a sign written in Macedonian. Have you passed through Arachinovo? I have no idea what world you live in

Niko777 12-01-2010 08:09 PM

[U][B][COLOR="Red"]ALBANIAN UCK TERRORIST Memorials[/COLOR][/B][/U] in Macedonia, and I'm not talking about those tacky statues (which exist in every Albanian village), I'm talking big, mega war memorials in remote locations up in the mountains. These are where the UCK followers are holding public gatherings and events. All of the construction was funded by the municipal governments, and ALL municipal budgets are [U]directly funded by the Macedonian government.[/U]

This one is located near Arachinovo (Skopje suburb). If anyone doesn't believe me, here are the coordinates if you want to view it from above on Google earth:

42° 1' 31.08" N 21° 35' 6.08" E

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/7166360.jpg[/IMG]

Here is another one, near Tetovo, coordinates: 42° 1' 49.26" N 20° 56' 46.58" E

[IMG]http://v1.cache4.c.bigcache.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/8654556.jpg?redirect_counter=1[/IMG]

Mastika 12-02-2010 10:04 AM

These monuments need to be the first thing destroyed when hostilities break out due to the Albanian separatists. you were right about the Shkenderbeg video, it is very upsetting. in fact this whole thread is depressing, however it is a reality that I think we must realise before any changes can be made. Any tourist driving from Skopje to Ohrid would think that they were in a muslim country, this is directly due to the Albanisation of Western Macedonia.

Niko777 12-02-2010 04:07 PM

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]ISLAMIC EXTREMISM AS A RESULT OF ALBANIAN NATIONALISM[/COLOR][/U][/B]

Propaganda videos supporting Al-Qaeda and a Greater Albanian are being openly SOLD in Skopje in the pazar IN FRONT OF EVERYONE'S EYES - yet, the police are not taking action! The photo below was taken in Skopje's main pazar, enlarge it to full size and look closely at the videos!!! [U]See anyone you recognize?[/U]

[IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/Islamic_propaganda_in_Skopje.jpg[/IMG]

Niko777 12-02-2010 04:33 PM

[U][B][COLOR="Red"]ALBANIAN-ISLAMIC EXTREMISM in Macedonia[/COLOR][/B][/U]

The following are mosques that have been built in the [U]past 5 years[/U]:

[B][U]SKOPJE REGION[/U][/B]

Selo Grchec

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/7254925.jpg[/IMG]

Vizbegovo (Skopje Suberb)

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/8487499.jpg[/IMG]

Butel, Skopje Suberb

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/25435760.jpg[/IMG]

Indzhikovo (Skopje Suberb)

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/38067483.jpg[/IMG]

selo Batinci

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/38241808.jpg[/IMG]

Saraj (Skopje suberb)

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/3306762.jpg[/IMG]

selo Laskarci

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/41005722.jpg[/IMG]

selo Arnakija

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/15212144.jpg[/IMG]

Stajkovci (Skopje suberb)

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/14288849.jpg[/IMG]

selo Studenchani

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/20995553.jpg[/IMG]

selo Mojanci

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/41018288.jpg[/IMG]

This one is under construction in Cair, Skopje, it is being built illegally with no permit on top of an Ottoman historical monument, but the police is not taking any action!

[IMG]http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii203/mitatos/arasta01.jpg[/IMG]

THERE ARE MANY MANY MORE WHICH I COULD NOT FIND PHOTOS, and yet, this is just in Skopje - I have not entered Tetovo yet! I know for a fact that this many churches have not been built in Skopje in the last 5 years, and the ones that have been built are very small in size compared to some of these mosques.

Niko777 12-02-2010 04:55 PM

[B][U]TETOVO REGION: Mosques built in the last 5 years[/U][/B]

Selo Bojane

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/17020373.jpg[/IMG]

selo Strimnica

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/7142958.jpg[/IMG]

selo Zhelino

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/32871505.jpg[/IMG]

selo Neprosteno

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/2254376.jpg[/IMG]

selo Slatino

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/1680659.jpg[/IMG]

selo Uzormiste

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/7527699.jpg[/IMG]

selo Prshovce

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/2556032.jpg[/IMG]

selo Nerashte

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/6048989.jpg[/IMG]

selo Tearce

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/4921983.jpg[/IMG]

selo Radusha

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/10990619.jpg[/IMG]

Tetovo city

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/40330585.jpg[/IMG]

selo Selce

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/10299738.jpg[/IMG]

Tetovo city

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/16739594.jpg[/IMG]

selo Sinichane

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/32386096.jpg[/IMG]

Islamic Centre on the Tetovo Highway

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/27786067.jpg[/IMG]

selo Gradec

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/7586492.jpg[/IMG]

selo Bogovinje

[IMG]http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/2803115.jpg[/IMG]

selo Pirok

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/14102570.jpg[/IMG]

selo Celopek

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/3590124.jpg[/IMG]

selo Negotino

[IMG]http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/14442385.jpg[/IMG]

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]80% of the above villages were Macedonian Orthodox 100 years ago[/COLOR][/U][/B]

Niko777 12-02-2010 05:26 PM

[B][U][COLOR="Red"]National Geographic Magazine - March 1996. Page 135.[/COLOR][/U][/B]

[URL=http://img153.imageshack.us/i/articleo.jpg/][IMG]http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/7097/articleo.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

Onur 12-02-2010 06:18 PM

[QUOTE=Niko777;80712]
This one is under construction in Cair, Skopje, it is being built illegally with no permit on top of an Ottoman historical monument, but the police is not taking any action![/QUOTE]

How this can happen there? How come they can do illegal construction on top of 500,600+ year old monument by changing it`s original shape? Are these people experts? Do they know how to do a restoration process? Sigh...


And there should be enough Ottoman era mosques there to serve the current muslim population in there. So, i agree to you that they have other intentions on this by covering it with religion.

protivpropaganda 12-02-2010 06:25 PM

[QUOTE=julie;80548]I have many questions, firstly welcome to the MTO.
Am unsure of where you are heading, in fact , whether you are a Macedonian or an Albanian posing as one, [/QUOTE]
Thank you for the welcome and be assured that I am very much a Macedonian.

It seems to me that you haven't been interested, hence haven't read up on the subject of international power politics and that is why you asked these questions. Nevertheless I will give you an answer for them and I will try to be as brief and concise as I can.

[QUOTE]Why did MACEDONIANS allow the enforcement of the framework agreement?[/QUOTE]
We didn't allow it. We were forced into it.
At that time existed a dilema for the political party in power. Does it engage in forced drafting of all male citizens and commiting genocide upon the shiptars or accepting a mediated truce. By accepting the second option many Macedonian lives were spared and our country remained intact. If the first option was chosen we would have annihilated the shiptars but would have fought with the western powers stationed in Kosovo and would have payed the ultimate price.
Which would you have chosen if it were up to you?

[QUOTE]Why did Macedonians allow the change in the flag?[/QUOTE]
We didn't allow it. It was early in our independence and the socialist scum in our society betrayed us. While many accepted our flag as is there was a considerable number of idiots who didn't accept it. The huge lie that it was temporary helped the cause of those that still felt that they didn't have anything in common with Macedonians but with slavs and serbs.

[QUOTE]Why did MaCEDONIANS allow an Albanian criminal that headed terrorist groups in parliament (Ahmeti) ?[/QUOTE]
We didn't allow it. We were forced into it.
At the end of the confllict of low intensity in 2001 Ahmeti was known as a righteous freedom fighter all around the world. While we were known as the represive majority. Again the socialist scum in our society brokered it so.

[QUOTE]Why do MACEDONIANS continue to negotiate our name?[/QUOTE]
Macedonians aren't negotiating their name. Our spineless politicians are doing it.
It is amazing how sterile minds can conjure up so many filthy thoughts. After I created the site Protivpropaganda I started to overtly propagate Euscepticism in 2002. I was looked down upon even by the Macedonian individual who was drowned in propaganda that by entering the EU all of our problems would magically disappear.
Again the leftist scum of our nation forced this policy into active political life where if anybody spoke against the EU was branded a traitor. Even though EUscepticism today plays a major role in political life nobody is willing to say it out loud as of yet but give it time, it will happen.

[QUOTE]Why do MaCEDONIANS insist on using goodwill to offer soldiers to NATO under that revolting acronym? Knowing full well NATO will never enter allow anything but fyrom )it pains me to write it[/QUOTE]
We are not an economical power, nor are we a millitary one. We are only 1,5 million strong with unloyal minorities. What do we have to offer that is appealing to the rest of the world. That action, although illogical, has given rise to considerable support among the member nations of NATO.

[QUOTE]Why do Macedonians insist on giving up everything in the 21st century just to gain enr into EU (who will give Macedonia a lovely debt to pay off Greece debt ??([/QUOTE]
We are not giving up anything, let alone everything. We had very little on the day of our independence and built ourselves up to almost looking like a prosperous nation. The political party in power isn't all that interested in selling out since EUscepticism is on the rise but again the leftist scum use this as their political propaganda platform and slur everything in our state to anybody willing to listen.

[QUOTE]That is the start of some of my questions in response to your post[/QUOTE]
I await the other questions and the questions that arise from my response since it is written only to explain things in general.



[QUOTE]
OziMak,
Thanks protivepropaganda for your suggestion which could have been summed up by the word scaremongering but you offer no evidence this is the case on this site…you neither discredit the concerns expressed as being nonexistent nor if they do exist attempt to explain why you think they are exaggerated.[/QUOTE]
If you have read carefully and understood correctly what I have written then you do not need me to collect the evidence it would have become self evident to you too.
The shiptar isn't as strong as we are weak at the moment but if push comes to shove we will rise to the occasion as we did in 2001. They do seem like an unstoppable force for now but so did the Ottomans, Serbs, Bulgarians and greeks in the past and yet here we are. That says a lot about us as a nation.
Right now anything we do to thwart their advancements jepardises us to an unaccepted level. The moment they lose the support of the western powers is the moment for payback.

[QUOTE]I personally still hold the view that the government will not change the name despite their political doublespeak but I am more concerned with the other pressing issue of the Albanian separatists. They have taken concrete progressive steps towards their end. If action is not taken soon to abate the situation later action will only have to be more severe…probably by armed conflict.[/QUOTE]
Armed conflict with the shiptars is inevitable. The best we can do is to correctly choose the right time to genocide their disgusting islamic butts. This time we wont accept mediation of peace until the last shiptar has fled our country.

[QUOTE]
Jankovska,
Scare tactic? When was the last time you went to Kumanovo, Skopje, don't get me started on Tetovo, Gostivar, Kicevo? You should be scared and every Macedonian should be scared. In Tetovo and gostivar you cannot find a sign written in Macedonian. Have you passed through Arachinovo? I have no idea what world you live in[/QUOTE]
You may not know what world I live in but I know what world you live in. The name of that world is Cowardlandia.:laugh:
BTW, I went window shopping for furniture in Arachinovo just 2 months ago. Last week I went to Tetovo to buy used spare parts for my car and low and behold I`m still alive.
Here's some well intentioned advice for you:
If you find yourself surrounded in darkness all you need to do is to light a candle. :thumbup:

Niko777 12-02-2010 06:46 PM

[QUOTE]How this can happen there? How come they can do illegal construction on top of 500,600+ year old monument by changing it`s original shape? Are these people experts? Do they know how to do a restoration process? Sigh...[/QUOTE]

[B]These people are NO experts, and they are actually destroying part of the monument for the foundations of the new mosque. Why are they doing it??? Because this location is right BEHIND the NATIONAL MUSEUM OF MACEDONIA! So when tourists come to see the museum, they will be surrounded by mosques! [/B]

You are correct, there are many Ottoman-era mosques to serve the population, Macedonia was gracious enough to preserve these UNLIKE our neighbors.

Jankovska 12-02-2010 06:47 PM

Firstly I would like you to explain to me why is it you think I live in Cowardlandia?
I went through Arachinovo on the 4th of November, not even a month ago. As you have mentioned you've been too, now tell me what do the houses of the Macedonians look like? Where are all the Macedonians? Also the Macedonians from Lipkovo, do you know where they are? They are still 'raseleni' they still live in a centre in Kumanovo with absolutley no one trying to help them. Have you heard of them, seen them, spoken to them? Have you seen how they live, what they eat? They have metal beds and a 4-5 member family live in one small room, that's the kitchen, the bathroom, the bedroom and the lounge.To you it may just seem like a scare tactic to me it's a scary reality. As you have been in Tetovo not to long ago can you tell me how many Macedonian signs in the shops there are? Hardly few. Where are all the Macedonians from this towns, what happened to them? Have you asked yourself. It is a scary reality mate and it's is not just a tactic as you call it, they are taking everything and we should be scared ALOT but also should do something about it if it's not too late.
As for the advice, please don't give me any coz you don't know me. I don't ever live in the darkness but I always live in reality. Maybe you should try it sometimes.

As for alot you said I agree but I don't agree that it's just a tactic, it is reality and the more we allow it the worse for us.

Oh and one more question. Earlier you said be scared Macedonians coz you have no hands to fight but in your response to Julie you are saying it's better we didn't fight because it was a lost war. So which one is it, fight and lose or not even take a shot because it is a lost war anyway? So if we fight we are wrong if we don't wrong again.


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