Pontians, Who are they ?

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  • Pelister
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 2742

    Pontians, Who are they ?

    In 1923, the Metropolitan of Trebizond, Chrysanthos, lead 164,000 Pontians to Greece.

    Neal Ascherson writes that it was "a country alien to them physically, climatically, politically and linguistically". p.186

    The identity of Pontians:

    "For the first time, intellectuals set out to give the Pontians an ethnic national consciousness. That required "origins" and "roots". Anythony Bryer relates how 'Triantaphyllides, a Chaldian school master ... christened his son Pericles and sent him to Athens, whence he returned after 1842 to teach Xenophon and classical Greek at the Trebizond Phrontisterion ... By 1846, schoolmasters had renamed [the Pontian town] Gumushane to a fancy 'Argyropolis'. In a typical example of cultural nation invention, the teachers proceeded to graft the Pontos people onto the stock not just of Byzantium but of Periclean Athens itself. All around the black sea the same process was going on." p.186

    Greek attitudes toward Pontians (what they don't tell you in the history books):

    Greeks resent the Pontians, because the Pontians insist they are different. The Pontians still dream about their "dead Romania" in folk songs and proclaim that "Romania is taken". They insist on the Catholic tradition of walking the Madonna every August down the procession ...etc.

    Greeks hate them, but they hate the Macedonians more.
  • Macedonian_Nationalist
    Member
    • Jul 2012
    • 407

    #2
    How can....

    How can a Turkish speaking people from Asia Minor who arrived in Macedonia only 70-80 years ago as a result of a population exchange now be considered "Greek" or "Greek Macedonian"?

    Has the world forgotten about the indigenous people of the region?

    Comment

    • makedonche
      Senior Member
      • Oct 2008
      • 3242

      #3
      Originally posted by Macedonian_Nationalist View Post
      How can a Turkish speaking people from Asia Minor who arrived in Macedonia only 70-80 years ago as a result of a population exchange now be considered "Greek" or "Greek Macedonian"?

      Has the world forgotten about the indigenous people of the region?
      Macedonian Nationalist

      Very good question indeed! Seems the world has forgotten many indigeneous peoples in many regions!

      BTW - - ot deka si?
      On Delchev's sarcophagus you can read the following inscription: "We swear the future generations to bury these sacred bones in the capital of Independent Macedonia. August 1923 Illinden"

      Comment

      • Macedonian_Nationalist
        Member
        • Jul 2012
        • 407

        #4
        Originally posted by makedonche View Post
        Macedonian Nationalist

        Very good question indeed! Seems the world has forgotten many indigeneous peoples in many regions!

        BTW - - ot deka si?
        Hello Makedonche

        I live in Melbourne but was born in Stip.. My mother is from Voden in Aegean Macedonia and my father is from Bukovo, Bitolsko.

        Comment

        • makedonche
          Senior Member
          • Oct 2008
          • 3242

          #5
          Originally posted by Macedonian_Nationalist View Post
          Hello Makedonche

          I live in Melbourne but was born in Stip.. My mother is from Voden in Aegean Macedonia and my father is from Bukovo, Bitolsko.
          Good to have another genuine Macedonian here! enjoy your stay and tell all your Macedonian friends and family to take a tour through the forum! BTW I'm from Kotori - before that our forefathers were from Voden as well!
          On Delchev's sarcophagus you can read the following inscription: "We swear the future generations to bury these sacred bones in the capital of Independent Macedonia. August 1923 Illinden"

          Comment

          • George S.
            Senior Member
            • Aug 2009
            • 10116

            #6
            welcome aboard MN.

            I don't think forgotten is the word id use more like ignored..you look at greek propaganda of what it tries to say about macedonians.Apart from a few slip ups of where they have actually acknowledged us by mistake as endopi.They have chosen to ignore our existence.Our existence has allways been there even when sees the huge differences of greek & macedonian.They have dliberately ommitted to mention our identity is as seperate as chalk & cheese.You look at greek identity ithas never been called macedonian & the land it took in 1912 was illegal so to justify that they are trying to say that they are macedonians.That's why they are mudying the waters with references like slav macedonian,name issue,greek macedonian,greek macedonia.All the time trying to legitimse their claim by referring to the past 2000 years ago.I have got relos back in bukovo ,love the jagotki bukovo piper.also kisela voda.
            Last edited by George S.; 07-20-2012, 10:15 PM. Reason: ed
            "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
            GOTSE DELCEV

            Comment

            • Macedonian_Nationalist
              Member
              • Jul 2012
              • 407

              #7
              Originally posted by makedonche View Post
              Good to have another genuine Macedonian here! enjoy your stay and tell all your Macedonian friends and family to take a tour through the forum! BTW I'm from Kotori - before that our forefathers were from Voden as well!

              Oh yes I know Kotori. My tetka actually married a man from Tresino.

              Actually I was confused with another village. Kotori is lerinsko right?
              Last edited by Macedonian_Nationalist; 07-20-2012, 10:31 PM.

              Comment

              • Macedonian_Nationalist
                Member
                • Jul 2012
                • 407

                #8
                Originally posted by George S. View Post
                welcome aboard MN.

                I don't think forgotten is the word id use more like ignored..you look at greek propaganda of what it tries to say about macedonians.Apart from a few slip ups of where they have actually acknowledged us by mistake as endopi.They have chosen to ignore our existence.Our existence has allways been there even when sees the huge differences of greek & macedonian.They have dliberately ommitted to mention our identity is as seperate as chalk & cheese.You look at greek identity ithas never been called macedonian & the land it took in 1912 was illegal so to justify that they are trying to say that they are macedonians.That's why they are mudying the waters with references like slav macedonian,name issue,greek macedonian,greek macedonia.All the time trying to legitimse their claim by referring to the past 2000 years ago.I have got relos back in bukovo ,love the jagotki bukovo piper.also kisela voda.
                Hi George!

                Yes they sure are a weird bunch aren't they? Quite possibly the most racist people in the world today.

                Yes, we are renowned for our piper the whole of Maceonia and some parts of the Balkans call it Bukovska piper.

                Comment

                • makedonche
                  Senior Member
                  • Oct 2008
                  • 3242

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Macedonian_Nationalist View Post
                  Oh yes I know Kotori. My tetka actually married a man from Tresino.

                  Actually I was confused with another village. Kotori is lerinsko right?
                  MN
                  Kotori is Lerinsko!
                  On Delchev's sarcophagus you can read the following inscription: "We swear the future generations to bury these sacred bones in the capital of Independent Macedonia. August 1923 Illinden"

                  Comment

                  • Phoenix
                    Senior Member
                    • Dec 2008
                    • 4671

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Macedonian_Nationalist View Post
                    How can a Turkish speaking people from Asia Minor who arrived in Macedonia only 70-80 years ago as a result of a population exchange now be considered "Greek" or "Greek Macedonian"?
                    ...i have no problem with them being 'greek' or even 'greek macedonian' or any hybrid classification of their own making and imagination...my problem is that they're now calling themselves... 'Macedonian'.

                    The original langauge (Turkish) spoken by these people is pretty well documented, the lesser known fact is the widespread Turkish customs that had to be stripped from them...perhaps forum member 'Voltron' can tell us how the 'hellenization' policies of the early 20th century in modern greece, transformed his Christian refugee grandparents of the former Ottoman Empire into first, 'greeks' and now 'Macedonians'...???

                    Comment

                    • Risto the Great
                      Senior Member
                      • Sep 2008
                      • 15658

                      #11
                      Welcome Macedonian_Nationalist.
                      Some of these Prosfigi/Madziri will try to tell you that Alexander took a dump in their backyard and as a consequence, they have a right to be called Macedonian. I believe they were simply other nationalities or ethnic identities that were not allowed to thrive in racist Greece.
                      Risto the Great
                      MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                      "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                      Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                      Comment

                      • Voltron
                        Banned
                        • Jan 2011
                        • 1362

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                        Welcome Macedonian_Nationalist.
                        Some of these Prosfigi/Madziri will try to tell you that Alexander took a dump in their backyard and as a consequence, they have a right to be called Macedonian.
                        Thats pretty rich since your treating Roma looking Hunza's as next of kin.

                        Phoenix, its been explained to you a million times wont even bother to make another attempt. Read a book and lay off the bath salts ffs didnt you see what happened in Miami ?

                        Comment

                        • Risto the Great
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 15658

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Voltron View Post
                          Thats pretty rich since your treating Roma looking Hunza's as next of kin.
                          No, I don't. They are called Hunza I believe.
                          Rich is former Turkish nationals who could not speak the Greek language calling themselves Greek and then starting to call themselves Macedonians. Actually it is poor.
                          Risto the Great
                          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                          Comment

                          • George S.
                            Senior Member
                            • Aug 2009
                            • 10116

                            #14
                            voltron another name for the hunza people is the kalash or kaleshi people If they are greek can you tell me what kaleshi means i bet you know bugger all .I'll give you a hint it's a macedonian word & not a greek word at all..
                            On the hunza people or kalash as they are known the greeks sent missionaries supposedly to help the people of the Hunza valley.They built schools etc tried to tell them that buildings were of greek design tried to teach them greek as well as tried to brainwash them to say they are greek they refused to do it.It has been drummed in them father to son etc they are descended from the macedonians. There's no way these people will say they are greek.
                            Last edited by George S.; 07-21-2012, 09:58 PM. Reason: ed
                            "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
                            GOTSE DELCEV

                            Comment

                            • George S.
                              Senior Member
                              • Aug 2009
                              • 10116

                              #15
                              Also how can you rename people once they are turkish,then greek then macedonian.No such thing as greek macedonian.Unless you made your propaganda in the last 70 to 80 years greek macedonian has never existed it is something new all made up. recently.The movement of populations was done forcible agains't the macedonian people's will do you know that.So when they bought in the prosfiges they altered the demographics.What right did greece to do that & then claim the prosfeges were macedonian.??
                              Last edited by George S.; 07-21-2012, 09:54 PM.
                              "Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
                              GOTSE DELCEV

                              Comment

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