Macedonian Truth Forum   

Go Back   Macedonian Truth Forum > Macedonian Truth Forum > Macedonian History

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-19-2009, 04:15 AM   #101
Pelister
Senior Member
 
Pelister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,742
Pelister is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soldier of Macedon View Post
Just a summary of quotes about Thracians.
This is pretty cool stuff.

The Getae were a Thracian tribe.

I have two other ancient sources/quote (separate from the ones above) that refer to the Sclavenes as "Getae".
Pelister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2009, 01:47 AM   #102
Soldier of Macedon
Senior Member
 
Soldier of Macedon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Macedonian Outpost
Posts: 13,529
Soldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Please share Pelister, I am sure they will be of interest.
__________________
In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.
Soldier of Macedon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2009, 09:49 PM   #103
Pelister
Senior Member
 
Pelister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,742
Pelister is on a distinguished road
Default

Although Theophylact Simocatta can be criticized for his use of synonyms, he mentioned that the Sclavenoi are "Getae".

The Romans are closing on the Sclavenoi in the northern plains of Thrace.

Quote:
The Romans drew near to the Getae (for this is the older name for the barbarians), but did not dare to come to grips, since they were afraid of the javenlins which the barbarians were sending from the barricade against their horses (vii.2.5 Theophylact Simocatta)
Theophylact's use of the term "Getae" as a synonym for the Sclavenoi, is paralleled by Marcellinus Comes (s.ann.505, 517 and 530).

Quote:
Marcellinus Comes, Chronicle, ed. T.Mommsen (Mgh Auct.Ant.xi, Chron. min.ii, Berlin,1893-4)
.

I am trying to get a copy of this source by Marcellinus Comes.
Pelister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2009, 10:49 AM   #104
Sovius
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 241
Sovius is on a distinguished road
Default

Of the Getai, Procopius wrote:

“They believe there is one god, that of lightning, creator of all; they believe him to be sole lord, and they sacrifice oxen and all sacrificial animals to him.”

Herodotus wrote this about the Getai around 1,000 years earlier:

“These same Thracians also shoot arrows up towards the sky when thunder and lightning come, and use threats to the god, not believing that there exists any other god except their own.”

This may explain the large number of cranial fractures found among Dacian burial sites and why modern Romanians tend to get very nervous when it rains.

Gebeleizis was the name of the Gothic sky god, as preserved in the Achaean creole language. This mythical figure was also referred to as Nebeleizis. Nebo means sky and giba means the stirring of things, a word associated with movement and motion among the Pelasgian languages.

Aristotle was a Macedonian philosopher. The ancient Macedonian kingdom was regarded as being populated by Illyrians and Thracians. Aristotle described God (no ‘s’) as the first mover, the first cause. Could it be that one of the great minds of the Ancient Period was influenced by a well established body of thought on the subject to the north of Athens?

How is it that the ethnicity of the father of scientific classification came to be misclassified by Western researchers? What knowledge and whose knowledge did the libraries of Pella hold?
Sovius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2009, 12:31 AM   #105
Pelister
Senior Member
 
Pelister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,742
Pelister is on a distinguished road
Default

Interesting cultural connection.

Its a pretty well established fact that the Getae were a Thracian tribe of old.

The Chronicles of Marcellinus

Quote:
Mundo, the Master of Illyrian Soldiery, was the first Roman general to set upon the Getae who had previously been traversing Illyricum and put them to flight, after quite a few of them had been killed (530) "...dudum Getis Illyricum..."
The translation uses the term "Goth" instead of "Getae".

But clearly,

Getis
Getae
Getam

Refer to "Getae", even though the translater choses to use the term 'Goths'.

Quote:
This invasion (517) by what Marcellinus calls "Getae" probably involved Sclavini, who had begun to launch attacks through Roman territory
The Chronicle of Marcellinus, p.121

The Getae are considered to be "Sclavenoi" by Vasiliev (1950) p.308, by Bury (1923) p.436, and "Antae" by Stein (1949) p.105.

Could a closer look at the Thracian language reveal to us what the language of the Sclavenoi, actually was??
Pelister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2009, 09:45 AM   #106
Soldier of Macedon
Senior Member
 
Soldier of Macedon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Macedonian Outpost
Posts: 13,529
Soldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond repute
Default

I think what remains of Thracian is conclusive enough to confirm that their language was indeed closely related to Balto-Slavic.
__________________
In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.
Soldier of Macedon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2009, 09:26 AM   #107
Sovius
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 241
Sovius is on a distinguished road
Default

Genetic and linguistic evidence are defining a chronology detailing the amalgamation of indigenous populations with migrating populations originating from North Africa and the Middle East along the southern fringes of Southeastern Europe. Lexical adoption can entail semantic transformations that, I believe, can be used to reconstruct the indigenous linguistic stratum without the use of Thracian artifacts, as the Achaean civilizations, because they left a linguistic record that can be dated, can be used to support the relative dating of words that must have been in use between two distant regions existing along the periphery of Trakia.

A well known example would be the relationship between ‘oditsi’ and ‘odysessy’. The contemporary Macedonian word continues to preserve a more basic meaning, in this case, to walk away, to depart, than its creole counterpart, which came to represent a long voyage. While the Sarmatian cognates to the north have been more thoroughly studied, demonstrating point C, thus providing a plausible hypothetical form for point B between C and A (Achaea), the Basque word ‘Ibilaldi’, when compared to ‘odi’, the root of ‘oditsi’, may be of greater importance in the long run. ‘alde egin’ means to walk away in the Basque language, demonstrating the phenomenon of agglutination, the joining together of two different words to make one word. ‘awl’ is ‘oh’ pronounced backwards in a sense. ‘oh’ is more mechanically conservative, possibly indicating adoption. Indigenous Iberian populations who originated in Illyria are currently regarded by geneticists as having inhabited the region for around 9,000 years or so. There are now two independent relative dates that can be used to frame these similarities from three different regions in Europe and three different languages.

It may be the biological descendents of the ancient Thracians who ultimately hold the key as to what word their ancestors used for departing. The challenge for Victorian theorists now is to provide evidence demonstrating linguistic discontinuity between points A, C and D that does not contradict Europe’s genetic and archeological records. To the best of my knowledge, the M17 genetic marker has not been found to any significant extent among the Basques of Western Europe. There is a reason why Alinei believes Indo-European toponyms are older in Iberia than Basque toponyms. Is there a connection between R1b populations in the Republic of Hellas, R1b populations the Basque country and R1b populations in the Caucus region? What should we make of Caucasian linguistic elements that remain in use in the Albanian language? It would be interesting to research whether or not Grecophone Albanians contributed anything from the Caucasian languages to the resurrected APMC that could be isolated from its pre-Modern stages.
Sovius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 06:25 PM   #108
Soldier of Macedon
Senior Member
 
Soldier of Macedon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Macedonian Outpost
Posts: 13,529
Soldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond reputeSoldier of Macedon has a reputation beyond repute
Default

References from Herodotus (some of the more fanciful stories are not to be taken too literally):
Quote:
I can say of my own knowledge that there is a custom like these offerings; namely, that when the Thracian and Paeonian women sacrifice to the Royal Artemis, they have straw with them while they sacrifice. Book 4, 33.
Quote:
Thrace runs farther out into the sea than Scythia; and Scythia begins where a bay is formed in its coast, and the mouth of the Ister, facing southeast, is in that country. Book 4, 99.
Quote:
The Scythians sent messengers to their neighbors, whose kings had already gathered and were deliberating on the presumption that a great army was marching against them. The assembled kings were those of the Tauri, Agathyrsi, Neuri, Maneaters, Black-cloaks, Geloni, Budini, and Sauromatae. Book 4, 102.
Quote:
The Agathyrsi are the most refined of men and especially given to wearing gold. Their intercourse with women is promiscuous, so that they may be consanguine with one another and, all being relations, not harbor jealousy or animosity toward one another. In the rest of their customs they are like the Thracians. Book 4, 104.
Quote:
The Thracians have many names, each tribe according to its region, but they are very similar in all their customs, save the Getae, the Trausi, and those who dwell above the Crestonaeans. Book 5, 3
Quote:
Among the rest of the Thracians, it is the custom to sell their children for export and to take no care of their maidens, allowing them to have intercourse with any man they wish. Their wives, however, they strictly guard, and buy them for a price from the parents. To be tattooed is a sign of noble birth, while to bear no such marks is for the baser sort. Book 5, 6.
Quote:
These men's borders, it is said, reach almost as far as the Eneti on the Adriatic Sea. Book 5, 9.
Quote:
Paeonia lay on the Strymon, a river not far from the Hellespont, and that they were colonists from the Teucrians of Troy. Book 5, 13.
Quote:
The Mysians and Teucrians which before the Trojan war crossed the Bosporus into Europe, subdued all the Thracians, and came down to the Ionian sea, marching southward as far as the river Peneus. Book 7, 20.
__________________
In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.
Soldier of Macedon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2015, 11:00 AM   #109
TheNikoWhiteIch
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 111
TheNikoWhiteIch is on a distinguished road
Default The Macedonians appear to have been a Thracian people.

I found a book that references the Macedonians to the Thracian race:

Quote:
The Macedonians appear to have been a Thracian people. The Argive Temenidae founded a Grecian state in Macedonia at an early period...But the language of the Macedonians was unintelligible to the Greeks. The Greek soldiers in Alexander's army understood not, as we learn from Quintius Curtius, a speech addressed to the Macedonians...If we give credit to Strabo, we must consider the Macedonians as a Thracian people. That geographer mentions several parts of the Macedonian country, and Pieria, on the borders of Thessaly, which he expressly says had been peopled by the Thracians...By this we can only understand that the Thracian language and Thracian manners still prevailed among the inhabitants of these countries...
Reference: Researches Into the Physical History of Mankind: ... James Cowles Prichard ... 3rd edition, Vol. III. Containing: Researches Into The History Of The European Nations. London, 1841. Book IV: Researches Into The Ethnography of Europe and Asia.
TheNikoWhiteIch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2015, 06:25 AM   #110
Toska
Member
 
Toska's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 137
Toska is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
By the 5th century BC, the Thracian presence was pervasive enough that Herodotus called them the second-most numerous people in the part of the world known by him (after the Indians), and potentially the most powerful, if not for their lack of unity
and if the thracians are protoslavic this would mean, that these people are the same people that spoke the same language that reside on the balkans today.
Toska is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
getae, sclavene, thrace, thracians


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump