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View Poll Results: Feel Macedonia is culturally Mediterranean or Slavic?
Mediterranean 2 66.67%
Slavic 1 33.33%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-07-2019, 09:14 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Tomche Makedonche View Post
I don't belive you would be erroneous by stating this, one only needs to look at the example of Yugoslavia for evidence to support this kind of view. Once Macedonians were “allowed” to be who they were, most eventually became accepting of the federation, with many becoming strong advocates of it.
I think it goes way beyond just Yugoslavia...

Macedonian's have embraced the countries of the 'new world'...Australia, USA, Canada etc...the real magic of nation building can only be fully realised when you treat people with respect and allow them to be who they are.
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Old 02-07-2019, 09:21 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Risto the Great View Post
They are Greeks nowadays in the same way as I am Australian. They have adopted the culture and perhaps more fully express themselves as Greek speakers. This is a logical outcome.

But as soon as any tension between the racial groups occurs, everyone knows precisely what they were or are.

Each successive generation knows less about it. But there you go.
I've always wanted to know more about the Egej perspective. I was always told second hand stories growing up but no one in our extended family has any roots there as far as I know.

I took my first and only trip to Egej a couple years ago, and I thought I encountered many people who are Macedonian, but none seemed to want to show it. Now I was an outsider, is it different when they are within their own circles? Do they try and maintain a connection to their roots at least in private?

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Originally Posted by Vangelovski View Post
. It will never really have a rapprochement with Macedonia no matter how many agreements they sign. Greeks and Macedonians around the world will never collaborate on anything without justice. We'll be in perpetual opposition to each other, regardless of where we are, for as long as Greece continues on this imperialist path.
That is a very good point that never gets mentioned. Their is this faux liberalism that dominates European politics. Its more similar to fascism but with a lot of fake smiles.
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Old 02-07-2019, 09:36 PM   #23
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is it different when they are within their own circles? Do they try and maintain a connection to their roots at least in private?
It is definitely different in private.
But the connection is fading rapidly now.
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Old 02-07-2019, 10:11 PM   #24
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It is definitely different in private.
But the connection is fading rapidly now.
sigh. I guess if Macedonians within their own country are fading away, what's left for those in a place like Greece.
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Old 02-07-2019, 11:34 PM   #25
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I'll admit the majority of my posts here are usually stupid but i'm just trying to learn & be apart of this community since I don't have really anyone to talk to about Macedonia & whats going on.
Hi Nushevski, you posts are not stupid. There is no need to beat yourself up.

If I may suggest something - I'm not sure how's your knowledge of Macedonian, but if you'd like to learn and connect to your roots it would be a good place to start/continue. There are some online resources, and learning/listening/speaking the language may allow you to connect or understand better the Macedonian culture and people. There are many videos on youtube; just one example - there are lots of Macedonian folk tales uploaded (Македонски народни приказни).
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Old 02-08-2019, 01:32 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Vangelovski View Post
But if in 1991 it just said, you know what, the cold war is over, we're in the EU/NATO, our borders are secure, let the Macedonians be, lets just pull together as friends and neighbours, they wouldn't have had to waste time, energy and money on Greekifying everything and trying to convince the rest of the world that everything is Greek. And they've never managed to do this, nor can they ever really achieve it. There's limits to propaganda and that limit is intelligence.
I think the Greeks considered the ship was already too far gone when it became evident that Yugoslavia was about to collapse. They say it usually takes just over three generations to assimilate a people into a new entity, the Greek state was encountering that pivotal point following 70 years of enforcing its brutal 19th century policy of ethnic cleansing, forceful assimilation and indoctrination to the national propaganda. Although there was a cultural shift happening globally (well more in westernised countries) regarding the acceptance of multiculturalism to freely exist within a “unicultural” nation’s society on the basis of respecting the fundamentals of basic human rights (instead of treating it as the threat it traditionally was viewed), Greece ultimately considered themselves to be on the final leg of their mission, and to change course at that point would be to unravel all the previous work done for the last 70 years.

Without any form of international pressure baring down on them, and taking into account the perceived threat that they could suffer the same fate as Yugoslavia at that time based on the reality of their multicultural make up, not to mention the real effects the living memory of the civil war still holds within their populace, the Greeks thought it best to just follow their plan to its end since they believed they were basically on the home stretch.

I believe this was a negative and backward way to approach the matter and I think they interpreted the “zeitgeist” incorrectly by continuing and dramatically ramping up the enforced policy of Hellenisation (which is essentially a form of Naturalisation, an ideology that was developed and promoted by the Romans, and not something which the ancient Greeks actually believed in) whilst also trying to promote this ridiculous perception of pure ethnic homogeneity (which funny enough is in direct contradiction with the idea of naturalisation).

All they managed to do with this policy is polarise our nations to a point where we remain in a state of perpetual opposition (as you said). Macedonians exist, and we are global now. Continuing on with a policy which tries to negate or erase our existence is futile and will only serve to strengthen our resolve and diminish any chances of reconciliation.
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Old 02-08-2019, 01:11 PM   #27
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Slavic ancestry in South Slavs (in my opinion) goes this way:
Slovenes>Croats>Bosnians>Serbs>Macedonians>Bulgari ans.
Bulgarians have (probably) some additional (extra) West Asian ancestry compared to other Slavic nations.

From Serbs and below they are more native than Slavic in my opinion.
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Old 02-08-2019, 10:48 PM   #28
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Congratulations Nushevski, you appear to have survived the baptism of fire.
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