United Macedonia Diaspora - Page 106

TajnataKniga · 01-11-2010, 11:51 PM

i dont see the flip-flopping. what do other macedonian organisations think of the framework agreement? why UMD on the spot and not others? UMD was founded when? 2004? looks like before the framework. they wrote it in their post. where were the other organisations? what were they doing to prevent the framework agreement? id like to see the macedonian government take rights away from albanians with the current circumstances. good luck! and isnt the macedonian government to blame for all this? that bastard crvenkoupolos. nobody can do anything now, neither UMD or gruevski.

TajnataKniga · 01-11-2010, 11:52 PM

has anyone seen the movie? anyone know what reviews its gotten?

TajnataKniga · 01-11-2010, 11:53 PM

great poll! UMD needs to call for macedonia to terminate the talks. and so should other macedonian organisations. everyone in the diaspora!

Vangelovski · 01-11-2010, 11:54 PM

TK,

Most Macedonian diaspora organisations actively opposed (and continue to do so) both the Interim Accord and the Framework Agreement. UMD is the only one that I am aware of to have called for its enforcement, advertise them as "progression" and use them as supportive arguments.

If we followed the argument that "noone can do anything now" and accepted the status quo, then we would still have been part of Yugoslavia. Remember Denko Maleski? He used the same scaremongering tactics that we see from UMD/Buktop & Co.

And if we were to accept your argument that "noone can do anything now", then why even bother having a 'cause'? Just accept the status quo and go along with whatever happens.

Soldier of Macedon · 01-11-2010, 11:57 PM

Hang on a sec - You said that you are fine with Meto's ZMR interview, why the sudden backflip? The 3-name solution ain't happening for you anymore?

Soldier of Macedon · 01-12-2010, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TajnataKniga

why UMD on the spot and not others?

Because they claim to represent the Macedonian Diaspora, that's why.

Quote:

"noone can do anything now"

What a great attitude.

Buktop · 01-12-2010, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Buktop,

UMD said it did not support the Interim Accord and ducked responding to the Framework Agreement. However, as usual, UMD is flip-flopping.

UMD has used the Interim Accord and Framework agreements as supportive arguments in many of their press releases - why would they do that unless they believed these agreements were legitimate and justified?

UMD has highlighted the fact that the Interim Accord was broken, this does not mean it supports the Accord, it means they are stating facts, and they advocate the government withdrawing from the Accord.

UMD has already posted you links concerning their stance on the Ohrid agreement, it might benefit you to look at them.

Vangelovski · 01-12-2010, 12:21 AM

UMD in many instances has objected to Greek actions (such as the veto at NATO) and to demonstrate that these actions were unjust or "illegal", they have used the Interim Accord to support their claim. Why would you do that unless you believed the Interim Accord was legitimate?

As for the Framework Agreement, Meto provided his own version of history.

Buktop, you've got nothing new to add here, other than parroting UMDs greatness.

TajnataKniga · 01-12-2010, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soldier of Macedon

Because they claim to represent the Macedonian Diaspora, that's why.

What a great attitude.

can anyone be 100% perfect? im not, nor are you, so why will UMD be?

what macedonians can do to change things is have god darn more babies and resettle the tetovo/gostivar area. koi ti je krev? everyone moved out, macedonians have one baby, albanians have 10.

but sorry im not going back to macedonia to have 10 babies, my future is not in macedonia, and i really doubt any of you will go back too. its easy for us in the emigrant communities to say what we believe, when we were not born in macedonia, never lived there, dont pay taxes, dont vote, dont have to live next door to albanians, and much more.

my energy is going to be spent on grease. albania gives macedonians rights too and just today appointed a macedonian to a government posting in Korca, read MINA. i think this is super. my worry is bulgaria and bulgarians more than anyone else.

Buktop · 01-12-2010, 12:24 AM

Talks do not connote an intention for compromising the name, identity, culture or language. I think that there is a big misconception concerning the terms "talk" and "negotiation"

Supporting talks does not mean you support selling out.

View Poll Results: Do you consider the UMD as your representative for the Macedonian Diaspora?
Yes	2	4.35%
No	44	95.65%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

01-11-2010, 11:54 PM	#1054
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,521	TK, Most Macedonian diaspora organisations actively opposed (and continue to do so) both the Interim Accord and the Framework Agreement. UMD is the only one that I am aware of to have called for its enforcement, advertise them as "progression" and use them as supportive arguments. If we followed the argument that "noone can do anything now" and accepted the status quo, then we would still have been part of Yugoslavia. Remember Denko Maleski? He used the same scaremongering tactics that we see from UMD/Buktop & Co. And if we were to accept your argument that "noone can do anything now", then why even bother having a 'cause'? Just accept the status quo and go along with whatever happens. __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams Last edited by Vangelovski; 01-11-2010 at 11:56 PM.

01-11-2010, 11:57 PM	#1055
Soldier of Macedon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Macedonian Outpost Posts: 13,660	Hang on a sec - You said that you are fine with Meto's ZMR interview, why the sudden backflip? The 3-name solution ain't happening for you anymore? __________________ In the name of the blood and the sun, the dagger and the gun, Christ protect this soldier, a lion and a Macedonian.

01-12-2010, 12:21 AM	#1058
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,521	UMD in many instances has objected to Greek actions (such as the veto at NATO) and to demonstrate that these actions were unjust or "illegal", they have used the Interim Accord to support their claim. Why would you do that unless you believed the Interim Accord was legitimate? As for the Framework Agreement, Meto provided his own version of history. Buktop, you've got nothing new to add here, other than parroting UMDs greatness. __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

01-11-2010, 11:51 PM	#1051
TajnataKniga Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: United Kingdom of Macedonia Posts: 196	i dont see the flip-flopping. what do other macedonian organisations think of the framework agreement? why UMD on the spot and not others? UMD was founded when? 2004? looks like before the framework. they wrote it in their post. where were the other organisations? what were they doing to prevent the framework agreement? id like to see the macedonian government take rights away from albanians with the current circumstances. good luck! and isnt the macedonian government to blame for all this? that bastard crvenkoupolos. nobody can do anything now, neither UMD or gruevski.

01-11-2010, 11:52 PM	#1052
TajnataKniga Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: United Kingdom of Macedonia Posts: 196	has anyone seen the movie? anyone know what reviews its gotten?

01-11-2010, 11:53 PM	#1053
TajnataKniga Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: United Kingdom of Macedonia Posts: 196	great poll! UMD needs to call for macedonia to terminate the talks. and so should other macedonian organisations. everyone in the diaspora!

01-12-2010, 12:24 AM	#1060
Buktop Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: NJ, USA Posts: 934	Talks do not connote an intention for compromising the name, identity, culture or language. I think that there is a big misconception concerning the terms "talk" and "negotiation" Supporting talks does not mean you support selling out.

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