Empowerment of Macedonians

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  • Bill77
    Senior Member
    • Oct 2009
    • 4545

    #31
    Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
    No its the positive one you provided. You called it a "great speech" and a boost to morale. Its the one that Mel Gibson gave in Braveheart. Do you even read your own posts?
    Thats a stupid question. A better question would be, do you?

    I just had a wonderful chat with a good friend. I brought up a scene from brave heart that we are all familiar with. The great speech to his army who's moral were low. They had now self esteem and started leaving before battle.

    It went something like "Yes you can all go back to your homes and live like slaves......They may take our lives but they will never take our freedom"
    And we all know what happened then.


    What would the reaction have been if he said,

    "Piss off home you wimps. You are nothing but traitors.....Live under a slave mentality or harden up sunshine"
    what support whould he recieved here.

    So Black is the great speech, Red is an ulternitive.
    Last edited by Bill77; 09-21-2011, 04:52 AM.
    http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=120873#post120873

    Comment

    • Vangelovski
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2008
      • 8531

      #32
      Originally posted by Bill77 View Post
      Thats a stupid question. A better question would be, do you?

      And we all know what happened then.


      what support whould he recieved here.

      So Black is the great speech, Red is an ulternitive.
      Bill, I was referring to the Black - Mel uses the word slaves. You said it was the great speech. But isn't that exactly the type of language you are against?
      If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

      The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

      Comment

      • Bill77
        Senior Member
        • Oct 2009
        • 4545

        #33
        Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
        Bill, I was referring to the Black - Mel uses the word slaves. You said it was the great speech. But isn't that exactly the type of language you are against?
        Sorry i get you now.

        Both examples mentions this (living as slaves). But you read the whole speech and you will see they do mention the same thing but how different they each come across.

        When will you understand where i am coming from. Its not what you address its how you do it. Its the point i am trying to make.

        Just don't tell me this somehow makes me a ventilator lover.
        http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=120873#post120873

        Comment

        • The LION will ROAR
          Senior Member
          • Jan 2009
          • 3231

          #34
          It is very important at how you approach things...and bill your example is great...

          Maybe marketing to a group of people such as the Macedonians in the republic regarding changing of the flag back and the Ohrid Agreement might not be ideal for us Diaspora’s to push for it only...but what we need are certain people or groups from Macedonia to push for it with our help of course to advertise and educate the Mass via Television / Media..
          Do we have such people/groups there already to do this..?
          The Macedonians originates it, the Bulgarians imitate it and the Greeks exploit it!

          Comment

          • Mikail
            Senior Member
            • Sep 2008
            • 1338

            #35
            I'm sure we do TLWR and that it is happening in some capacity. Televizija Sonce has started doing this in this regard.

            Empowerment comes through education, achievement, reward.

            In marketing terms, you never focus on the negatives of a product or idealogy. All marketing processes go through what is known as a SWOT analysis - a strategic method of finding Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities & Threats. Once you go through this process you want to see more strengths & opportunities, You want to know about your weaknesses & threats and never play to them.

            Always know your target market. This is broken up into your primary market, folllowed by tiers if 2nd & 3rd level markets. You need to know what message you are sending and to whom. There is never one message to go out to all.

            Trying to win anyone over by continually throwing negatives at them gets them to switch off.
            Last edited by Mikail; 09-21-2011, 08:07 AM.
            From the village of P’pezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

            Comment

            • julie
              Senior Member
              • May 2009
              • 3869

              #36
              Originally posted by George S. View Post
              macedonians have embraced a particular mindset & they don't even think of contemplating of getting out.They feel trapped & unless they have somekind of revolution there is no way out.
              George, that is what this thread is about. Revolution, protest, demonstration.
              Its about empowerment of Macedonians and I am asking not for the obvious but solutions and how to get there
              "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse Delchev

              Comment

              • julie
                Senior Member
                • May 2009
                • 3869

                #37
                Originally posted by The LION will ROAR View Post
                It is very important at how you approach things...and bill your example is great...

                Maybe marketing to a group of people such as the Macedonians in the republic regarding changing of the flag back and the Ohrid Agreement might not be ideal for us Diaspora’s to push for it only...but what we need are certain people or groups from Macedonia to push for it with our help of course to advertise and educate the Mass via Television / Media..
                Do we have such people/groups there already to do this..?
                William Wallace was an awesome Scottish leader who inspired and revolted against the English, and knew his people well.
                And awesome LWR, this is about our target audience, not the diaspora who can do so little so far away, but empowering Macedonians within Macedonia who physically have to do this
                "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse Delchev

                Comment

                • Mikail
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 1338

                  #38
                  The power of the internet is underestimated in many ways in regard to what you can do to get your message across.

                  The power of Utube, Facebook, Twitter & the now Google plus can be bigger than any TV or radio campaign

                  Check out what Wallabies coach Robbie Deans is doing here for all to see. Sending out a positive message is much more rewarding.


                  Celebrate every little victory

                  Celebrate every little victory - YouTube

                  Positive thinking, positive choices
                  Positive thinking, positive choices - YouTube

                  Getting motivated with realistic goals
                  Getting motivated with realistic goals - YouTube

                  Staying motivated
                  Staying motivated - YouTube
                  From the village of P’pezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

                  Comment

                  • julie
                    Senior Member
                    • May 2009
                    • 3869

                    #39
                    Originally posted by Mikail View Post
                    I'm sure we do TLWR and that it is happening in some capacity. Televizija Sonce has started doing this in this regard.

                    Empowerment comes through education, achievement, reward.

                    In marketing terms, you never focus on the negatives of a product or idealogy. All marketing processes go through what is known as a SWOT analysis - a strategic method of finding Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities & Threats. Once you go through this process you want to see more strengths & opportunities, You want to know about your weaknesses & threats and never play to them.

                    Always know your target market. This is broken up into your primary market, folllowed by tiers if 2nd & 3rd level markets. You need to know what message you are sending and to whom. There is never one message to go out to all.

                    Trying to win anyone over by continually throwing negatives at them gets them to switch off.
                    awesome stuff Mikail!

                    By empowering Macedonians through educating them on the positives of achieving the outcome (getting the government to declare IA null and void from strong public pressure as an example) , they will feel stronger and more national pride, and that is the biggest reward
                    "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse Delchev

                    Comment

                    • julie
                      Senior Member
                      • May 2009
                      • 3869

                      #40
                      Love your work Mikail!
                      We need contacts and strong individuals within Macedonia that can start getting that message across, in small groups that will get bigger and bigger

                      The whole purpose of this thread is my frustration in inaction
                      And as nothing has happened to date in macedonia in getting large scale peaceful protests happening, it is up to the diaspora to help awaken individuals to start this process, we are here, for moral support , so they can be the ones to physically change their situation
                      "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse Delchev

                      Comment

                      • Mikail
                        Senior Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 1338

                        #41
                        That's right Julie. The important thing is to remain positive. We know our weaknesses and our threats, we also know our strengths and our opportunities. What does one perceive to be more important. The SWOT in its entirerity is important as an excercise, this makes one aware of a products or ideas marketability and acceptance both commercially and socially.
                        Last edited by Mikail; 09-21-2011, 08:29 AM.
                        From the village of P’pezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

                        Comment

                        • Risto the Great
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 15658

                          #42
                          I'm sorry but I have to chime in. Feel free to shoot me down due to my obvious and unashamed interest in Macedonia's national sovereignty. Some seem to have arrived at a desire to develop marketing strategies to help our poor Macedonian brothers and sisters in Macedonia to wake up. Trying to develop a strategy which nicely and gently wakes up our brothers & sisters to the error of their ways and the despair of the situation. Has it occurred to the nicer people among us that this smacks of the same superiority complex that people like me appear to have in relation to Macedonia's sovereignty?

                          Instead of spelling it out bluntly, the revised suggestion appears to be one which basically wants to tell the Macedonians they are essentially morons in a nice(r) way.

                          I'd much rather be honest and say the following:

                          Your successive governments sold you out by changing your name, flag and constitution. You are second class citizens in your own country. You let it happen. You can fix it but it will require sacrifices that will need to surpass the fighting spirit of our Macedonian ancestors.

                          I see both approaches as demeaning but then again I also see Macedonians as a demeaned race of people.
                          Risto the Great
                          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                          Comment

                          • Bill77
                            Senior Member
                            • Oct 2009
                            • 4545

                            #43
                            Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                            I'd much rather be honest and say the following:

                            Your successive governments sold you out by changing your name, flag and constitution. You are second class citizens in your own country. You let it happen. You can fix it but it will require sacrifices that will need to surpass the fighting spirit of our Macedonian ancestors.

                            I see both approaches as demeaning but then again I also see Macedonians as a demeaned race of people.
                            I like this RTG if only you can take away the "You let it happen". Then this message would create anger towards the government minus any guilt. If its guilt you wan't you will not get it. If anything, you will get resentment and comments such as "well why don't you from the diaspora come down and do something about it". I'm sure you've heard it before.

                            There will be nothing there to suggest they are at fault but its the government to blame, unless they don't take action and nothing gets done then the blame will be on there shoulders. I like it.
                            http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=120873#post120873

                            Comment

                            • Daniel the Great
                              Senior Member
                              • Nov 2009
                              • 1084

                              #44
                              Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                              Instead of spelling it out bluntly, the revised suggestion appears to be one which basically wants to tell the Macedonians they are essentially morons in a nice(r) way.

                              I'd much rather be honest and say the following:

                              Your successive governments sold you out by changing your name, flag and constitution. You are second class citizens in your own country. You let it happen. You can fix it but it will require sacrifices that will need to surpass the fighting spirit of our Macedonian ancestors.
                              I agree, I am afraid this is the only manner in which the Macedonians in the Republic will have any chance to waking up and realizing the fact that they are loosing there Macedonian identity, it couldn't be anymore straight forward then that.

                              Comment

                              • Vangelovski
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2008
                                • 8531

                                #45
                                Originally posted by Bill77 View Post
                                I like this RTG if only you can take away the "You let it happen". Then this message would create anger towards the government minus any guilt. If its guilt you wan't you will not get it. If anything, you will get resentment and comments such as "well why don't you from the diaspora come down and do something about it". I'm sure you've heard it before.

                                There will be nothing there to suggest they are at fault but its the government to blame, unless they don't take action and nothing gets done then the blame will be on there shoulders. I like it.
                                Bill, didn't your parents teach you personal responsibility? What's with the moddly coddling? Of course they let it happen. They need to own up to it and do something about it.
                                If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

                                The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

                                Comment

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