DPmNE's track record

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  • Risto the Great
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 15658

    #91
    Pimp My Parliament
    Risto the Great
    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

    Comment

    • Phoenix
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2008
      • 4671

      #92
      Originally posted by Niko777 View Post
      ...People were shocked at the amount of luxury that DPMNE was spending on inside the offices.
      Putting aside any notion of corruption or aesthetic appeal of the renovation for the moment, I strongly believe that the country should put as much money as it can afford into it's parliament/government building.

      Even when you can't act as a responsible government, at least try and look the part.

      Comment

      • Skolovranec
        Junior Member
        • Mar 2017
        • 52

        #93
        How about we put some of that money in stimulating home businesses, both small and medium-sized? I heard that's part of the program of the new government, allegedly.

        Or maybe pouring that money into our military? You know, it wouldn't hurt, considering the times we're in. God knows DPMNE didn't do frack about either.

        Originally posted by Pelagonija View Post
        In todays Macedonia Bulgarian thinking and actions have no relevance or consequences
        You don't think handing out bulgarian passports as shopping cards is a detrimental enough action?
        Last edited by Skolovranec; 06-02-2017, 07:15 AM. Reason: adding another reply
        Anti-EU Pro-Guns National-Libertarian Trekkie Minarchist
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        • Risto the Great
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 15658

          #94
          Originally posted by Skolovranec View Post
          Or maybe pouring that money into our military? You know, it wouldn't hurt, considering the times we're in. God knows DPMNE didn't do frack about either.
          Money into the military. A poofteenth ago the DPmNE coalition defence minister was an ethnic Albanian. They have proven themselves to be enemies of the Macedonian homeland. Why pour money into a corrupt system?
          Risto the Great
          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

          Comment

          • Skolovranec
            Junior Member
            • Mar 2017
            • 52

            #95
            Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
            Money into the military. A poofteenth ago the DPmNE coalition defence minister was an ethnic Albanian. They have proven themselves to be enemies of the Macedonian homeland. Why pour money into a corrupt system?
            Of course there should be pre-requisite steps taken before pouring money there, I agree. That would be the more difficult step to take rather than just modernizing and advancing the state of the military with financial injections. The corruption needs to be dealt with first.

            Considering both largest macedonian parties have no problem with coalitions with albanians, maybe we need a more nationalist party to emerge and if it wins - to simply say fuck no to the so called May Agreement.

            Such a party could later easily just ethnically reconstruct the military with only loyal patriots, which sadly would mean most if not all-macedonian military (perhaps if there are other ethnicities, they won't be even albanian).
            Anti-EU Pro-Guns National-Libertarian Trekkie Minarchist
            Anti-NATO Pro-United MK Agnostic Secularist Magick Occultist
            Anti-UN Pro-Military Meritocratic Integrationist Altruistic Socio-Darwinist
            Anti-Globalist Pro-Choice Intellectual Pirate Spiritual Vagabond

            Comment

            • Niko777
              Senior Member
              • Oct 2010
              • 1895

              #96
              New Macedonia PM Finds ‘Empty Coffers, Big Debts’

              "The condition of the budget we encountered is far from great. There is not 130 million but only six million in the budget," Zaev said in an interview with Macedonian Radio Television, MRT.

              "The public debt had exceeded the threshold of 50 per cent of GDP and there are many unnecessary expenditures. There is a hidden debt which is greater than one billion euros," Zaev said, adding that these are just his preliminary findings after assuming office last Wednesday.

              Macedonia's former ruling VMRO DPMNE party accused new Prime Minister Zoran Zaev of lying about finding an almost-spent budget and a big hidden debt when he took office last week.

              Comment

              • Risto the Great
                Senior Member
                • Sep 2008
                • 15658

                #97
                I fear even the most principled Macedonian from RoMacedonia will believe it is a RITE and a RIGHT to steal when assuming a leadership position. How can they not? 500 years of Ottoman leadership thieving preceded by the Byzantine church and the promise of eternal salvation (for a fee). They have not been exposed to anything else, ever.

                The more I think about it, the more I firm my position that only a government in exile has a chance to redeem the FYROMIAN SLAVE NATION from its downward spiral.


                Originally posted by Skolovranec View Post
                Of course there should be pre-requisite steps taken before pouring money there, I agree. That would be the more difficult step to take rather than just modernizing and advancing the state of the military with financial injections. The corruption needs to be dealt with first.

                Considering both largest macedonian parties have no problem with coalitions with albanians, maybe we need a more nationalist party to emerge and if it wins - to simply say fuck no to the so called May Agreement.

                Such a party could later easily just ethnically reconstruct the military with only loyal patriots, which sadly would mean most if not all-macedonian military (perhaps if there are other ethnicities, they won't be even albanian).
                Risto the Great
                MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                Comment

                • Risto the Great
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 15658

                  #98
                  Said every new political party assuming leadership.

                  In this case, perhaps more believable.

                  Originally posted by Niko777 View Post
                  New Macedonia PM Finds ‘Empty Coffers, Big Debts’

                  "The condition of the budget we encountered is far from great. There is not 130 million but only six million in the budget," Zaev said in an interview with Macedonian Radio Television, MRT.

                  "The public debt had exceeded the threshold of 50 per cent of GDP and there are many unnecessary expenditures. There is a hidden debt which is greater than one billion euros," Zaev said, adding that these are just his preliminary findings after assuming office last Wednesday.

                  http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti....tgTw5Q9s.dpuf
                  Risto the Great
                  MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                  "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                  Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                  Comment

                  • Phoenix
                    Senior Member
                    • Dec 2008
                    • 4671

                    #99
                    Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                    Said every new political party assuming leadership.

                    In this case, perhaps more believable...

                    New Macedonia PM Finds ‘Empty Coffers, Big Debts
                    Like you said, it's the first statement rolled out by new governments all over the world.
                    I have no doubt that there's always an element of truth to the statement but I am particularly cynical of this coming from the new government in Macedonia...remember ZZ promised all sorts of things to the lemmings that supported him, amongst the many glittering turds that he showered the lemmings with was the promise of increased wages and pensions...he could never deliver a fraction of his electoral promises...he knew that from the very beginning, knowing that this would be a great excuse not to deliver.

                    ZZ (& Gruevski) and the shiptar mafia are all the same, each is there to fleece the state from under the noses of the sheep.

                    It's interesting that political ambition is being pushed further and further to the outer periphery of self-interest, where human decency and morality hold no true currency.

                    This has become the new normal, a twilight zone that exists as a fine filament between reality and fantasy, the space now occupied by the Trump's of the world...politicians who are the modern version of the ancient greek bearing gifts...this is the place that is most comfortable to Macedonia's political class, the place where you can make any promise imaginable, knowing there's jack-shit responsibility or accountability in you ever having to deliver said promise, the place where Macedonian politicians come bearing the gifts of fruitful prosperity only for their gift to drop it's malevolent seed...

                    Comment

                    • Skolovranec
                      Junior Member
                      • Mar 2017
                      • 52

                      Originally posted by Niko777 View Post
                      New Macedonia PM Finds ‘Empty Coffers, Big Debts’

                      "The condition of the budget we encountered is far from great. There is not 130 million but only six million in the budget," Zaev said in an interview with Macedonian Radio Television, MRT.

                      "The public debt had exceeded the threshold of 50 per cent of GDP and there are many unnecessary expenditures. There is a hidden debt which is greater than one billion euros," Zaev said, adding that these are just his preliminary findings after assuming office last Wednesday.

                      http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti....tgTw5Q9s.dpuf
                      At first he confirmed there were 180 M euros there. Then 130 with 50 Mil. missing. What the hell is this gibberish now? 124 million more are gone?

                      Is this like with the phantom voter fraud? Is he gonna keep changing the numbers as time goes by?

                      Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                      I fear even the most principled Macedonian from RoMacedonia will believe it is a RITE and a RIGHT to steal when assuming a leadership position. How can they not? 500 years of Ottoman leadership thieving preceded by the Byzantine church and the promise of eternal salvation (for a fee). They have not been exposed to anything else, ever.

                      The more I think about it, the more I firm my position that only a government in exile has a chance to redeem the FYROMIAN SLAVE NATION from its downward spiral.
                      Well, those who won't steal are probably uninterested in politics or have no sense of national consciousness to even begin pondering about such a career. They're too busy having everything and keeping it that way.

                      Which is why I initially liked Trump and supported him. He was too rich to be bribed or bought. I liked some of his core policies and could draw some parallels to what is happening in Macedonia and how it could be dealt with. If you are disappointed in his later decisions (like I was), I'll say that has more to do with his daughter and her husband than himself. Deepstate is also there.

                      I'm not that pessimistic about political parties. I don't think we can make that assumption based on 2, maybe 4 recognizable and influential macedonian parties we have had so far. In essence, it's still a 2-party system. Smaller parties tend to flock to one or other other side. Nobody stands their ground as a third side. I think that's what's needed.

                      As far as stealing goes, perhaps a thorough financial report, tax info, spending info, financing info etc. could be released to the public on a monthly basis? In spirit of transparency and what not. That way people can't even fabricate that you are stealing. Or at least such attempts would be very poorly constructed.

                      TL;DR: We need a macedonian Trump. Without the silly hairdo. And without a crazy globalist daughter. Or Jesus. You can't corrupt Jesus.
                      Anti-EU Pro-Guns National-Libertarian Trekkie Minarchist
                      Anti-NATO Pro-United MK Agnostic Secularist Magick Occultist
                      Anti-UN Pro-Military Meritocratic Integrationist Altruistic Socio-Darwinist
                      Anti-Globalist Pro-Choice Intellectual Pirate Spiritual Vagabond

                      Comment

                      • Karposh
                        Member
                        • Aug 2015
                        • 863

                        Originally posted by Skolovranec View Post
                        Well, those who won't steal are probably uninterested in politics or have no sense of national consciousness to even begin pondering about such a career. They're too busy having everything and keeping it that way.
                        Originally posted by Skolovranec View Post
                        We need a macedonian Trump. Without the silly hairdo. And without a crazy globalist daughter. Or Jesus. You can't corrupt Jesus.

                        I'm sure you're just being facetious and that you don't seriously believe the above? In any case, since you brought it up, if there are people out there who seriously believe the notion that it is humanly impossible to resist the temptation of keeping your hands out of the cookie jar unless you have some sort of divine powers then this says a lot about those people doesn't it?

                        The goal of any society would surely be to weed these elements out of their government and try to bring them to justice. And not, to simply accept corruption as an inevitable part of public office. That's ridiculous.

                        Comment

                        • Risto the Great
                          Senior Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 15658

                          It could be argued the conditions of superannuation for politicians represents a dipping of the cookie jar. They are so far from community expectations that they would represent a lower end of scale of the temptations you are discussing. As is the use of private jets and a whole bunch of other things on a scale.

                          Originally posted by Karposh View Post
                          I'm sure you're just being facetious and that you don't seriously believe the above? In any case, since you brought it up, if there are people out there who seriously believe the notion that it is humanly impossible to resist the temptation of keeping your hands out of the cookie jar unless you have some sort of divine powers then this says a lot about those people doesn't it?

                          The goal of any society would surely be to weed these elements out of their government and try to bring them to justice. And not, to simply accept corruption as an inevitable part of public office. That's ridiculous.
                          Risto the Great
                          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                          Comment

                          • Karposh
                            Member
                            • Aug 2015
                            • 863

                            Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                            It could be argued the conditions of superannuation for politicians represents a dipping of the cookie jar. They are so far from community expectations that they would represent a lower end of scale of the temptations you are discussing. As is the use of private jets and a whole bunch of other things on a scale.
                            Blatant, below-board, corruption is what I thought this thread was about. Inflated superannuation for politicians and parliamentary travel entitlements can also be argued is above-board scamming of public money (even if that happens to also include private jets). That's where the court of public opinion comes into it. Don't forget "Choppergate" with ex-Australian Speaker of the House, Bronwyn Bishop. She dug her heels in and refused to resign over it because she didn't see anything wrong with spending $5000 of public money, as is her right as a parliamentarian, to jump in a helicopter and fly from Melbourne to Geelong (an hours trip by road) but, in the end, the pressure to do so was such that even this stuck-up bitch had no choice but to resign.

                            Comment

                            • Phoenix
                              Senior Member
                              • Dec 2008
                              • 4671

                              Originally posted by Karposh View Post
                              Blatant, below-board, corruption is what I thought this thread was about. Inflated superannuation for politicians and parliamentary travel entitlements can also be argued is above-board scamming of public money (even if that happens to also include private jets). That's where the court of public opinion comes into it. Don't forget "Choppergate" with ex-Australian Speaker of the House, Bronwyn Bishop. She dug her heels in and refused to resign over it because she didn't see anything wrong with spending $5000 of public money, as is her right as a parliamentarian, to jump in a helicopter and fly from Melbourne to Geelong (an hours trip by road) but, in the end, the pressure to do so was such that even this stuck-up bitch had no choice but to resign.
                              I wonder if Bishop would have been forced to 'walk the plank' if we didn't have an independent media and as you've mentioned a vigilant public.
                              The media plays an important 'watchdog' role in most civilised and advanced societies, she was torn to shreds in every medium, from the most reputable print media sources, tv and radio news and commentary as well as ridiculed by a host of social commentators and the general public through social media, talk-back radio and print feedback.

                              These are all avenues that just don't exist to any mature or developed levels in Macedonia...unfortunately.

                              Comment

                              • Skolovranec
                                Junior Member
                                • Mar 2017
                                • 52

                                Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
                                The more I think about it, the more I firm my position that only a government in exile has a chance to redeem the FYROMIAN SLAVE NATION from its downward spiral.
                                Risto, I forgot to ask yesterday, how exactly would a government in exile work?

                                Originally posted by Karposh View Post
                                I'm sure you're just being facetious and that you don't seriously believe the above? In any case, since you brought it up, if there are people out there who seriously believe the notion that it is humanly impossible to resist the temptation of keeping your hands out of the cookie jar unless you have some sort of divine powers then this says a lot about those people doesn't it?

                                The goal of any society would surely be to weed these elements out of their government and try to bring them to justice. And not, to simply accept corruption as an inevitable part of public office. That's ridiculous.
                                I was only trying to be humorous. Humor sadly is not my best suit. Of course I don't believe that every political party, or politician for that matter is or can be corrupted/bribed/blackmailed. But you have to admit that the track record, at least for Macedonia, is not that great.

                                But then again, and I mentioned this in my other post, we've only really had two political parties to represent us. It's not like we have a working sample of two dozens of them as acting governments of the country so that we can deduce that there is something in the water that makes Macedonian politicians swing very hard towards corruption and greed. I do think that there are honest and honorable people here. I just don't think they are very much interested in politics. Those that are, likely have some greedy and shady prospects for entering that career in the first place. Which would explain why even globally, politicians tend to be more or less corrupt and greedy bastards.

                                If I was involved in politics I wouldn't care about money since I'm earning enough from a couple of different sources, and I was raised differently, and lead a frugal life. I guess that could be said of others too, yet some have taken different roads when coming in power, but I can only speak of myself and my own frame of mind and conviction. I see a country hanging on a thread, of which I'm a part of, and nobody who has been, is, or likely will be in power seems to give a fuck about it, but to fill their pockets and sedate their power hunger. The worst choice is when you have no choice, but an illusion of choice. No matter who you choose, you fail. That was our situation these 27 years.

                                I really need to do some research on why no political party has decided to be #3, but a minion/satellite party of the two biggest ones. Why be a third wheel rather than affirm itself as a third option. There must be some quirks in electoral laws or when you form one.
                                Last edited by Skolovranec; 06-09-2017, 03:32 AM.
                                Anti-EU Pro-Guns National-Libertarian Trekkie Minarchist
                                Anti-NATO Pro-United MK Agnostic Secularist Magick Occultist
                                Anti-UN Pro-Military Meritocratic Integrationist Altruistic Socio-Darwinist
                                Anti-Globalist Pro-Choice Intellectual Pirate Spiritual Vagabond

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